#UFchat – chat for urban fantasy writers

Transcript from Nov 27, 2010 – Black Friday & beyond: Crowds, collateral damage & instant mobs (shopping hazards in UF!)

While many people were out braving ‘the madding crowd’ (or ‘maddening crowd’ as many may think of it), hunting down bargains and more in the Black Friday+ sales we went ahead and had #UFchat, specifically to talk about crowds in urban fantasy. They’re a standard trope of the action genre and so appear in UF often too but when you add a little super-to-the-natural the potential in crowd scenes – for both the ‘crazy’ and the ‘wow!’ – goes up a few notches.

TOPIC: Crowds, collateral damage & instant mobs (shopping hazards in UF!).

(eg. Throw in a little pack power and the ability to some supernaturals to affect a crowd and you’ve got yourself a crowd scene – UF style.)

Official UFchat questions in YELLOW for easier reading.

Resources/ topic-related links are in BLUE.

Hold onto your hats, your wallets and watch your back – it’s time to shop UF style. πŸ˜‰

MarciSischo: RT @inkgypsy: 30 min countdown to #UFchat! Crowds, collateral damage & instant mobs (shopping hazards in UF!) Get our tips before you hit the mall. 3pmPST
10:44 pm inkgypsy: @MarciSischo Woo hoo! We gonna do us some shoppin’ UF style (hope you have your helmet & body armor ready!) #UFchat
10:45 pm inkgypsy: Bong bong bong! Only 15 mins to #UFchat! From crowd to mob in a 10 sec sale, mix in supernaturals = shopping is dangerous in UF territory!
10:45 pm UF_Chat: Bong bong bong! Only 15 mins to #UFchat! From crowd to mob in a 10 sec sale, mix in supernaturals = shopping is dangerous in UF territory!
10:47 pm MarciSischo: @inkgypsy Collateral damage is a fav. I write for the sheer joy of knocking down buildings and blowing things up. πŸ˜€ #UFChat
10:48 pm inkgypsy: @MarciSischo You’re totally our kind of girl! πŸ˜‰ (More stories please – Die Hard UF style? Bring it!) #UFchat
10:50 pm inkgypsy: Swapping hats to my #UFchat mod helmet (need one today!). Boots getting strapped on & body armor too I take my UF shopping seriously! πŸ˜‰
10:51 pm MarciSischo: @inkgypsy Thanks! Although… the DHS is probably now watching my Twitter feed. Fiction, DHS guys! I meant fiction! #UFChat
10:52 pm UF_Chat: Primer for #UFchat early birds: That Horrible Crowd! http://bit.ly/hQhVGG #UFchat
10:52 pm inkgypsy: Primer for #UFchat early birds: That Horrible Crowd! http://bit.ly/hQhVGG #UFchat
10:53 pm shadowflame1974: Ready for some UF collateral damage today! #ufchat
10:54 pm shevdon: Listening in to #UFChat – What’s it about?
10:56 pm MarciSischo: @shevdon Collateral damage & crowds, apparently. πŸ˜€ #UFChat
10:57 pm inkgypsy: @Shevdon You’re welcome to drop by, observe, pitch in. πŸ™‚ Tweetchat makes it easy. Just use #UFchat hashtag.
10:57 pm shevdon: @Shevdon But don’t agree that Invasion of Body Snatchers is anti-soviet – depends on perspective #UFChat
10:57 pm shevdon: @inkgypsy Thanks, I will #UFchat
10:57 pm J_GriffinB: @shevdon Urban Fantasy, crowds of people and witnesses to paranormal activity and what it might mean, think… #UFchat
10:58 pm MarciSischo: @shevdon I’ve read that’s the way the author meant it. #UFChat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: 3, 2… & now live with #UFchat! Among seas of strangers in a shopping mall it?s a playground of power for UF locales. #UFchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: Not sure how many we have on board -many are out doing that scary ‘shopping’ thing – but you guys will be prepared when your turn! #UFchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: It?s Open Season ? for Crowds! Shopping season & the potential for collateral damage & instant mobs in UF. #UFchat #UFchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: Reminder: ?S? stands for statement, which will be followed by a ?Q? (a related #UFchat question for discussion). #UFchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: NEWSFLASH: Zombies invaded multiple major cities in late October (real news folks!) http://bit.ly/gdr7Hv & http://bit.ly/h7cqXv #UFchat
11:01 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat (S) I’d worry about witnesses, were I the typical UF character with a concern over keeping my differences secret. #UFchat
11:01 pm MarciSischo: Gah. I did ten years on front lines in restaurants for Black Friday. Couldn’t drag me out shopping this weekend for $$ or <3! #UFChat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: Q: Those who clicked link saw news of multi city takeover. Civilian reaction varied. Your response: band together or hide out alone? #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Agreed. Me too. #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo I’ve heard some scary stories to rival actual UF plots from this year. *shudder* Grenades, bomb plans… eek. #UFchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: Turns out New York City = very jaded & immediately took it for promo stunt it was. Many Asian populations/tourists freaked tho? #UFchat
11:03 pm MarciSischo: A: Goin’ it alone, at least at first. Let the zeds weed out the idgits, then we can talk about banding together. #UFChat
11:04 pm AuthorWilliam: Checking in for #ufchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: I noted most ?ESPECIALLY ?official? news sources- carefully worded articles to make INSTANTLY clear zombie breakout was a stunt. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: TODAY: We look at hazards of crowds in UF ? collateral damage to instant mobs. What potential foes/friends are MCs shopping amongst? #UFchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: S: Shopping season is upon us and it?s Open Season for crowds! There are many types of strangers-together-type gatherings. #UFchat
11:04 pm shevdon: @inkgypsy I am following #UFChat as a separate stream πŸ™‚
11:04 pm UF_Chat: Q1: Apart from shopping crowds, what are some other ways in which complete strangers voluntarily share the same space? #UFchat
11:04 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat I threw a guy out once for abusing his wife & kid in the restaurant on Black Friday. Smacking them around. πŸ˜› #UFChat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam *waves hi!* #UFchat
11:05 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat a I already have my post-apoco team selected. #UFchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Wow. I hope he was humiliated & learned his lesson (prob not but I hope anyway). #UFchat
11:05 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Airports, trainstations, courts, hospitals, some churches and tourist traps. #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Smart! #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: Q1a: What are some (temporarily) closed spaces? (eg elevators, subways) #UFchat
11:06 pm MarciSischo: A2: Biggest draw would be a crowd to watch the show, if your MCs were throwing down on the street. #UFChat
11:06 pm dianapfrancis: movies, trains, planes, rallies, foodlines, #ufchat
11:06 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam *waves hi!*<<< Hi! I’ve missed this chat! πŸ™‚ #ufchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: Q1b: What are some more open spaces with high foot traffic? (Hint ? where do you often see security guarding more than $?) #UFchat
11:06 pm MarciSischo: A2: Terry Pratchett had a lot of fun w/ that in Ankh Morpork. #UFChat
11:07 pm UF_Chat: I have some lists coming next so we can discuss next few questions with a broad range in mind. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:07 pm dianapfrancis: closed places: rides at theme parks, submarines, panic rooms, bathrooms, okay, getting silly here #ufchat
11:07 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A1b Amusement parks, sports venues. #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: @dianapfrancis Not so silly! Bathrooms are scary – potential for conflict & panic high. All xlnt UF scenes. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: S: Some common crowds in UF (used AS CROWDS not just settings): Shopping crowds, cafe/bar crowds, pack/hive gatherings #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: S: Com. crowds cont: raids, zombie hordes, jail cell inmates, police mtngs, college groups, orgies (esp vamps), parties, conventions #UFchat
11:08 pm MarciSischo: Stacia Kane had a scene with zombies attacking MC in the bathroom. That was fun. #UFChat
11:09 pm dianapfrancis: @UF_Chat and prisons. Jail cells. lines of all sorts. #ufchat
11:09 pm MarciSischo: MC beat it with the shower head, if I remember right. #UFChat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: S: Less common crowds in UF: Schools, offices (used as crowd), traffic, elevator groups, subway travelers, bank customers, churches #UFchat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: Q1c: What other under-utilized crowds (used as crowds, not settings) spring to mind that have good conflict potential for UF? #UFchat
11:10 pm MarciSischo: Bar brawl! πŸ˜€ #UFChat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Bathrooms are used a lot in horror movies for a reason. Weird not as much in UF! #UFchat
11:10 pm dianapfrancis: @UF_Chat I’ve used traffic jams. #ufchat
11:10 pm J_GriffinB: A1c) military bases, bowling alley, State debate championships. #UFchat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Yep – bars are one of regular settings in UF – rarely read an all out brawl tho. So much potential. #UFchat
11:10 pm shevdon: A1c I’ve used a funeral quite effectively – lots of emotion, social constraints, and wonderful overtones #UFchat
11:11 pm UF_Chat: S: Crowds of strangers can become many things ? allies, enemies & casualties. They?re standard in action movies & therefore UF too. #UFchat
11:11 pm UF_Chat: Q2: What are some memorable crowd movie scenes? (& why?) (Hint: horror scenarios have a few?) #UFchat
11:11 pm J_GriffinB: @dianapfrancis Should be natural, the way we are so woefully underprepared for evacuation of our urban centers. #UFchat
11:12 pm UF_Chat: @shevdon Funerals – yes! Graveyards used a lot in UF but usually at night. Tho authors getting more creative recently. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:12 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Gremlins, the bar scene and the movie theater always get me. #UFchat
11:12 pm MarciSischo: Airport, for real. Considering current atmosphere, the panic factor would be astronomical. #UFChat
11:12 pm LdyDisney: @UF_Chat Parking Structures at malls are a good setting… Could be alone, but also a threat of passerbys and parking security. #UFchat
11:12 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Funny – I remember that as a stand out too. #UFchat
11:12 pm JLCoburn: Going to try and keep up with #UFChat for @UF_Chat and hopefully I’ll add something as a former ‘predator’ of crowds. #ufchat
11:12 pm StephanieLMcGee: #UFChat The rooftop scenes in Independence Day come immediately to mind. That calm as the ship opens, and then zap.
11:13 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Airports have that whole teary goodbyes, insanely happy hellos emotional tension too. Useful. #UFchat
11:14 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn OK – that was officially scary – and considering the company here you fit right in. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:14 pm UF_Chat: Q2a: What are some crowd behaviors/patterns/responses you can think of? #UFchat
11:14 pm shevdon: Think of the funeral scene in Watchmen – lots of flashbacks, retrospectives, and an emotional payload #ufchat
11:14 pm UF_Chat: S: As per action movies, while UF MCs are usually loners there are usually a few scenes where crowds are present. #UFchat
11:15 pm JLCoburn: #UFChat Places like onboard planes mid flight, boats and large busses they share a lot of the same crowd mentalities. #ufchat
11:15 pm UF_Chat: Q3: What are some memorable scenes of crowds in UF stories? How were they used? #UFchat
11:15 pm MarciSischo: Crowds have a habit of not getting involved. Many instances of crowds watching horrible things & doing nothing. #UFChat
11:15 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A2a: Asshattery. Groupthink. Add the wrong four people to a crowd, it can get ugly, fast. #UFchat
11:15 pm MarciSischo: They did a study — had someone “mugged” in front of a crowd. People stood and watched. No one helped. #UFChat
11:16 pm UF_Chat: S: Crowds can serve many uses to MCs too, especially when the supernatural is involved. #UFchat
11:16 pm UF_Chat: Q4: How could a crowd be useful to a UF MC? #UFchat
11:16 pm MarciSischo: Only takes one tipper to turn a crowd into a mob, though. Study showed, one or two people getting involved, brings the — #UFChat
11:16 pm MarciSischo: — whole crowd down on you. #UFChat
11:16 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo That’s so scary to me. It’s why we’re told to yell ‘fire’ instead of ‘help!’ – ridiculous. #UFchat
11:16 pm shadowflame1974: crowds could be an energy source or a place to hide #ufchat
11:16 pm JLCoburn: @MarciSischo #UFchat Trust me, pick pockets depend on that ‘shocked awe and watching’. #ufchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo The instigator. (Sounds like a bad movie title) #UFchat
11:17 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat Right? Insane. #UFChat
11:17 pm shevdon: Pitchforks, flaming torches, shouting! #ufchat
11:17 pm JLCoburn: #UFchat Someone screaming ‘Thief! My purse!” Makes all eyes turn to them and makes it easy for a predator to slip away. #ufchat
11:17 pm MarciSischo: @JLCoburn I believe it. #UFChat
11:18 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Depends on the purpose of the crowd in the first place. Shoppers unlikely to step in, but protesters a different animal. #UFchat
11:18 pm AuthorWilliam: A4 there is so much energy potential any time you get a crowd moving in one direction or another. Can work with or against the MC #ufchat
11:18 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @shadowflame1974: crowds could be an energy source or a place to hide #ufchat
11:18 pm UF_Chat: @shadowflame1974 Hiding is easy in a crowd. πŸ™‚ Hard to think of good uses because of the stop n watch thing. #UFchat
11:18 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Not for everyone. #UFchat
11:18 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Crush! Mind you – if you can harness kinetic energy as one of your powers… lots of potential! #UFchat
11:18 pm MarciSischo: Emotional crowds easily manipulated by one charasmatic character, too. Protest rallies come to mind. #UFChat
11:19 pm AuthorWilliam: Any time you get a “group agreement” as we call it in improv, you can take a simple action or idea to a big impact event. #ufchat
11:19 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat If armed or disturbing of appearance (bloodied, fanged), a person will have a space around them as crowd stampedes to avoid #UFchat
11:19 pm UF_Chat: Q4a: How could a crowd be ACTIVELY used against a UF MC? (beyond prearranged pitchforks & torches πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:20 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat Absolutely! #ufchat
11:20 pm MarciSischo: A4: Mind control. #UFChat
11:20 pm MarciSischo: A4: Panic stampede over MC. #UFChat
11:20 pm shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB huge amount of confusion too as everyone only sees a little but not the whole thing #ufchat
11:20 pm MarciSischo: A4: People calling the cops on MC. #UFChat
11:20 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Yessss! #UFchat
11:20 pm UF_Chat: S: Crowds have the potential to be allies or executioners. #UFchat
11:21 pm MarciSischo: A4: Youtube era — people taping MC, putting it on the internet. #UFChat
11:21 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat a4a: To point out just how bizarre the character appears to the ruck and run of humanity. #UFchat
11:21 pm UF_Chat: Q5: What are some factors (be specific) that could turn a happy holiday shopping crowd into an angry mob? #UFchat
11:21 pm JLCoburn: A4a: Hampering movement. Giving a villain a way to hide or distract the MC. Perfect setting to relieve the MC of something valuable. #ufchat
11:21 pm AuthorWilliam: @MarciSischo Yes, if crowd can be used as a weapon against the MC by a hidden antagonist..stakes skyrocket #ufchat
11:21 pm shadowflame1974: how about rumors easy to spread with everyone gathered at the same place #ufchat
11:21 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo Or even just recording it on cell phones w/video #UFchat
11:22 pm MarciSischo: A5: The store ran out of Cabbage Patch dolls. #UFChat
11:22 pm UF_Chat: @shadowflame1974 Ooh nice! Rumors – Chinese whispers even. Talk about confusion-making or rabble rousing! #UFchat
11:22 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat A5 Just one disagreement by a pair of unstable minds. #ufchat
11:22 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB That’s what I was thinking — all those videos of cops beating people up on Youtube, etc. #UFChat
11:22 pm ajackwriting: A bucket of red paint and a scream of “Oh God! He killed her!” would turn a crowd very quickly. #UFchat
11:23 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A5 Have the Character appear to do something terribly wrong. The were good guy gnoshing on child vamp stirs crowd #UFchat
11:23 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Nice! (news – recording – live viral videos etc) #UFchat
11:23 pm MarciSischo: A5: The villian points at MC and screams, “She’s got the last one!!” Crowd froths at mouth, brawl ensues. #UFChat
11:23 pm shadowflame1974: even something as simple as slight of hand or illusion could turn a crowd #ufchat
11:23 pm AuthorWilliam: Recently I witnessed a Pee wee flag football game become a brawl between the adults. The gas was on and when the match lit? BOOM. #ufchat
11:23 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Can do if crowd already packed – eg sales rush. #UFchat
11:24 pm MarciSischo: (A5 — Hmm, that’s fun, actually. Might use that one. πŸ˜‰ ) #UFChat
11:24 pm JLCoburn: @MarciSischo Brings up cop beatings. Let’s not forget all the issues crowd control involve. Heightened emotions, easily provoked. #ufchat
11:24 pm UF_Chat: Think about shopping crowds tho – mostly individuals rather than the sales rush/crush. What could turn large lot of shoppers? #UFchat
11:24 pm shadowflame1974: @AuthorWilliam true gather two opposing sides… seen that before #ufchat
11:24 pm UF_Chat: Q5a: What are some things that could unite complete strangers ? for good or bad (& perhaps aid a UF MC in the process)? #UFchat
11:25 pm ajackwriting: A good trick one of my antagonists uses is making the hero’s feet stick to the ground in the middle of a fast moving crowd. #UFchat
11:25 pm AuthorWilliam: @ajackwriting LOL #ufchat
11:25 pm shadowflame1974: Items not marked properly, not enough, or customers know there are only so many at the store #ufchat
11:25 pm MarciSischo: Loose crowds like shoppers more likely to get involved over things like animal abuse, child abuse. #UFChat
11:25 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Sports events are heightened I think because of physical aspect already there in players – + me vs you teams. #UFchat
11:25 pm MarciSischo: Kick a dog at the mall sometime, all hell will break loose. #UFChat
11:26 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat There are few things that will stir everyone these days. Not everyone is conditioned to take action. #UFchat
11:26 pm MarciSischo: I’ve seen it happen. Some guy got his ass WHUPPED. #UFChat
11:26 pm JLCoburn: A5a: Nationality. A crowd of one nationality is easily brought to bear against someone of a different nationality. Political rallies #ufchat
11:26 pm UF_Chat: @ajackwriting LOL! Ouch. #UFchat
11:26 pm AuthorWilliam: A5a just the rumor of a threat to a child can turn a crowd on whoever the perceived “threat” is #ufchat
11:26 pm shevdon: Just throw money into a crowd – $20 bills everywhere – see what happens – #ufchat
11:26 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Interesting how true that is – more so than if child is hit even. #UFchat
11:27 pm MarciSischo: @shevdon Oh, like the original Batman movie! The Joker did that! #UFChat
11:27 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @JLCoburn: A5a: Nationality. A crowd of one nationality is easily brought to bear against someone of a different nationality. Political rallies #ufchat
11:27 pm J_GriffinB: It is why officers taking a suspect into custody are accused far more often than convicted of beatings, even when video exists. 1/2 #UFchat
11:27 pm JLCoburn: @shevdon It doesn’t even have to be $20s. Toss a large number of $1s and they’ll still go beserk. #ufchat
11:27 pm shevdon: @MarciSischo Money is almost universal #UFChat
11:27 pm annikkawoods: *sneaks in and tucks herself in a corner* #ufchat
11:27 pm UF_Chat: @shevdon Jackpot madness! MC carrying money to use as a weapon in that case! #UFchat
11:28 pm J_GriffinB: People are no longer familiar with what it takes to subdue someone, and they certainly don’t know what is permissible and isn’t. 2/2 #UFchat
11:28 pm MarciSischo: Hi! I see you there, @annikkawoods! #UFChat
11:28 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn That’s a pro of American money all being green (I know that’s changing but still)… Good point! #UFchat
11:28 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat @shevdon OMG. So totally using that. *takes notes* #UFChat
11:28 pm annikkawoods: @MarciSischo *waves* #ufchat
11:28 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat @shevdon Or even the illusion of money or lottery tickets, anything of value. Nice. #UFchat
11:28 pm UF_Chat: @annikkawoods *throws parade in your honor* Oh sorry – missed the sneak part. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:29 pm AuthorWilliam: Anything that touch a crowds since of security can cause them to turn on the “threat” – a misunderstood MC can be in serious trouble #ufchat
11:29 pm UF_Chat: S: In True Blood Season 2 whole town of Bon Temps loses inhibitions under influence of Maenad & becomes dangerous in multi ways. #UFchat
11:29 pm UF_Chat: Q5b: Apart from damage done at the time what could fallout of whole community taken over be to humans & supernaturals? #UFchat
11:29 pm annikkawoods: @UF_Chat LOL Sorry I’m late. Roommates were having issues & someone needed to play peace keeper/referee. #ufchat
11:30 pm MarciSischo: I think in True Blood, the townsfolk didn’t remember much after the fact. #UFChat
11:30 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A5b PTSD to the nth power, anyone? Eggs has it so bad he can’t live with himself. #UFchat
11:30 pm UF_Chat: @annikkawoods That’s appropriate for today. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:30 pm MarciSischo: Lost opportunity, there. Can you imagine a crowd remembering those events? #UFChat
11:30 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat Are the Supernaturals the ones doing the taking over? #ufchat
11:30 pm UF_Chat: Q5c: In a UF shopping crowd who would end up being the collateral damage & why? (if crowd lose inhibitions) #UFchat
11:30 pm MarciSischo: “OMG, I slept with so n’ so. I cheated on my wife/husband. I killed a guy.” Etc. #UFChat
11:31 pm shevdon: A shared secret, and shared guilt, can be a very powerful motivation #ufchat
11:31 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Partly I think it’s because they ‘chose’ not to. If we all pretend the facts will go away – right? Wrong. #UFchat
11:31 pm UF_Chat: @shevdon Exactly. #UFchat
11:31 pm MarciSischo: A5 — Kids come to mind, first. Smaller, easily trampled or lost or taken. Also, depnding on actions of crowd? Things could get ugly #UFChat
11:32 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat a5c Depends on the density of the crowd. It is always the small and frail get run over, crushed. #UFchat
11:32 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam It’s your story – what do you prefer? πŸ˜‰ (Seriously – sometimes are power, sometimes are victims) #UFchat
11:32 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat True. #UFChat
11:32 pm UF_Chat: Q5d: What about supernatural collateral damage? Who &/or where would that be? #UFchat
11:33 pm J_GriffinB: a5a though anyone who stands against the will of a mob can get smoked too. #UFchat
11:33 pm UF_Chat: S: Security and police and regular characters in UF, both of the mundane & supernatural types. #UFchat
11:33 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat If Supernaturals and humans are struggling to co-exist and an imperial power steps in, S and H may put aside differences #ufchat
11:33 pm UF_Chat: Q6: What types of crowd control methods are you aware of (peaceful thru forceful)? #UFchat
11:33 pm MarciSischo: How about a reluctant vampire losing his mind in a crowd, slaughtering dozens? #UFChat
11:33 pm JLCoburn: And just think if the MC instigates a crowd to get away from an Antag, then finds out later that a child was trampled. Guilt anyone? #ufchat
11:33 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat a5d If they are required by some organization to keep secret their powers, they are in for a visit from enforcers #UFchat
11:33 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam This is one of those open vs closed world questions too. Makes all the diff where the two meet. #UFchat
11:33 pm MarciSischo: Something like that could raise all sorts of hell in a crowd. #UFChat
11:34 pm ajackwriting: q5d: If the whole town loses it and there’s even a hint of the supernatural then entire town will be alert for weeks on end #UFchat
11:34 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn Ack – you know how to twist the knife man! (Are you writing this down? Your book is going to make me cry – hard to do!) #UFchat
11:34 pm JLCoburn: A6: Oh wow…umm…I could spend hours on police procedures for crowd control. Benefits of being a cops kid you know lots of it. #ufchat
11:34 pm annikkawoods: A5 – You also have to look at someone like me w/social anxiety in that. If I were caught in something I’d never leave home again. #ufchat
11:35 pm MarciSischo: RT @JLCoburn: And if the MC instigates a crowd to get away from Antag, then finds out later that a child was trampled. Guilt anyone? #UFChat
11:35 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Yum. And if there were other ‘good’ sharks, er, vamps in crowd who were fine until smelled it.. struggle! #UFchat
11:35 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat a6 Do you really want to know? Much more boring than you’d expect. #UFchat
11:35 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn What are some unusual ones? (Looking up procedures reveals fascinating stuff!) #UFchat
11:36 pm shadowflame1974: crowds can be controlled by barriers, restricting the amount of people in 1 place or with police/guards #ufchat
11:36 pm J_GriffinB: @JLCoburn Please go on. #UFchat
11:36 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat Ooo, I like the “sharks” idea. Gang of vamps going into a feeding frenzy because 1 n00b screwed up? #UFChat
11:36 pm UF_Chat: Q6a: What additional preparations/tactics might be used by supernatural security teams? #UFchat
11:36 pm JLCoburn: For crowd control, calling in the fire department to hose the crowd isn’t common much anymore. That hose can knock someone flat. #ufchat
11:37 pm UF_Chat: Q7: Speaking of security teams, this group appears to be the bane of many UF MCs. Why? #UFchat
11:37 pm MarciSischo: SWAT and riot control teams come to mind. Fire hoses, rubber bullets, tear gas clouds. #UFChat
11:37 pm annikkawoods: @UF_Chat If you’re going up against supernaturals, you’re going to be carrying some nasty stuff to take them down for sure. #ufchat
11:37 pm shadowflame1974: Q6a antimagic gear, garlic, crosses and silver bullets #ufchat
11:37 pm shevdon: @UF_Chat Hand out refreshing soda – doped, psychic mind supression, subsonics, riot foam – oops! #UFchat
11:37 pm MarciSischo: Holy water fire hoses? #UFChat
11:37 pm JLCoburn: Usually though, police presence in full riot gear is enough to keep most crowds at little more than a roar. #ufchat
11:38 pm UF_Chat: @annikkawoods Or maybe crazy simple things too – eg salt #UFchat
11:38 pm UF_Chat: @shevdon I’m totally keeping your comments as notes! LOL #UFchat
11:38 pm UF_Chat: S: Social media encourages groups of (often) complete strangers to interact regularly & build connection. (like us!) #UFchat
11:38 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo Fire hoses are not part of the continuum of force for use against crowds in any jurisdiction in the US I am aware of. #UFchat
11:38 pm JLCoburn: A7: Security teams are seen as private sector, so have an agenda that a MC can’t always plot out like they can government. #ufchat
11:38 pm UF_Chat: Q8: How might the age of the internet be used in UF, considering most kick-ass is hand-to-hand? #UFchat
11:39 pm ajackwriting: @UF_Chat Multiple opponents complicates any combat, and that goes x10 for a well trained cohesive teams.Powers wont always save you. #UFchat
11:39 pm annikkawoods: You’ve also got the knockout gas, smoke bombs, flash grenades, and tasers. #ufchat
11:39 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB Not anymore, I don’t think, but maybe you’d bring it back if you had Supes to deal with? #UFChat
11:39 pm J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 this would be dependent on how openly aware the society was of the paranormal.. #UFchat
11:39 pm JLCoburn: A8: Just look at how quickly Cooks Source got shut down after one blogger mentioned they stole a recipe. Need I say more? #ufchat
11:39 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn Good point. Wonder who’s really in charge – is there a separate agenda happening? #UFchat
11:39 pm AuthorWilliam: A8 following social media GPS updates for an ambush. #ufchat
11:40 pm MarciSischo: A8: Flash mob gone bad? #UFChat
11:40 pm UF_Chat: S: The movie The Net (Sandra Bullock) exposed a loner MC & forced her involvement with people. #UFchat
11:40 pm UF_Chat: Q9: Considering UF often takes place ?now? or in near-future how might loner MCs be forced by tech to use crowds? #UFchat
11:40 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo If you’re able to use it, you’re able to use a significantly higher level of force. #UFchat
11:40 pm shevdon: @UF_Chat ALl this much more difficult in a closed world – the Internet is a persistent record of events #UFchat
11:40 pm ajackwriting: A8 You could use the internet/social media to discredit a damning video as a fake. #UFchat
11:41 pm MarciSischo: Ooo, I like that one! RT @AuthorWilliam: A8 following social media GPS updates for an ambush. #UFChat
11:41 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo I was wondering if someone would bring up flash mobs. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:41 pm J_GriffinB: @AuthorWilliam A8 that has been used against law enforcement. Foul. #UFchat
11:41 pm JLCoburn: There are newer non lethal control methods in development. High decibel sound waves is showing serious promise. #ufchat
11:41 pm J_GriffinB: @JLCoburn I like the sunburn gun, and the vomit beam #UFchat
11:41 pm MarciSischo: @AuthorWilliam Some phone apps will check you automatically for 4Square or Facebook. #UFChat
11:41 pm JLCoburn: @AuthorWilliam That’s why I say sites like foursquare are a stalker’s wet dream. #ufchat
11:42 pm UF_Chat: Is there such a thing as GVMNT issuing an alert to all social networking sites as an override yet? Equiv. of air raid siren? #UFchat
11:42 pm shevdon: @UF_Chat Think CCTV, Mobile phones, Hi-Def video, news helicopters, police surveillance #UFchat
11:42 pm J_GriffinB: @JLCoburn Or a super that has particular dietary needs? #UFchat
11:42 pm UF_Chat: S: Back to daily life. Crowds are used most often as ?collateral damage? or for MC anonymity. #UFchat
11:42 pm annikkawoods: A8: You can use the net like my characters do – secured websites, private chat rooms, & scrambled emails. #ufchat
11:42 pm UF_Chat: Q10: What other uses might a UF MC have for a crowd if they are a) supernatural b) 100% human? #UFchat
11:42 pm MarciSischo: @UF_Chat Could be a good plot. Internetomancy causing deadly flashmobs to appear and savage innocents. Set to music. }:) #UFChat
11:43 pm annikkawoods: A9: If you read the Harper Blaine books you meet Quentin, who does something just like that. He’s very good at it too. #ufchat
11:43 pm JLCoburn: Depending on the time of day, some mobile LED signs have been programed with random color patterns. Almost seizure inducing. #ufchat
11:43 pm AuthorWilliam: @MarciSischo One time I was trying to use twitpic and when I posted it had automatically posted a map and my location along w/ pic #ufchat
11:43 pm UF_Chat: Funny that in internet age info flow is hard to stop yet it’s easier to hide who you are in many ways. #UFchat
11:44 pm JLCoburn: Those things screw with most people, distraction, disorientation. Makes it easier to regain control in the confusion. #ufchat
11:44 pm UF_Chat: Q11: What about disasters ? natural or supernatural? How are crowds used in UF in these situations? #UFchat
11:44 pm MarciSischo: @AuthorWilliam I’ve had similar things happen. πŸ˜› It’s amazing what kind of info sneaks out when you’re not looking. #UFChat
11:44 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Oh crap! ‘dislike button’ #UFchat
11:45 pm UF_Chat: S: Zombie emergencies have the unique UF privilege of having crowds on bad side and good (usually, tho often they fall apart). #UFchat
11:45 pm annikkawoods: A10: Humans can be used to hide his trail if he’s human. #ufchat
11:45 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo @AuthorWilliam Google is Big Brother. #UFchat
11:45 pm UF_Chat: Q12: What other kinds of UF crowd-vs-crowd situations have potential? #UFchat
11:45 pm JLCoburn: A11: Mainly I’ve only ever seen them used as chaos during disasters, then responding in various ways after the initial event. #ufchat
11:45 pm AuthorWilliam: @MarciSischo I know, I used check in for the first time on FB & now it asks me over and over if it can use my location when I login #ufchat
11:45 pm MarciSischo: A11 — Charlaine Harris used Hurricane Katrina to devastate her vamp population in New Orleans. #UFChat
11:46 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB @AuthorWilliam Yep. It really is. #UFChat
11:46 pm annikkawoods: A10 & A11: Cannon fodder. Bait for something worse. Or just chaos until the situation is back under control. #ufchat
11:46 pm UF_Chat: Q12a: What about packs? Are all packs in UF related? #UFchat
11:46 pm MarciSischo: A11, cont, it changed up the whole political situation in the books. #UFChat
11:46 pm JLCoburn: @J_GriffinB Dietary needs brings to mind the Blood Bath from the first Blade movie. Good way to incite a riot. #ufchat
11:46 pm UF_Chat: Q12b: What are some supernatural/paranormal crowd groups (not teams) to be wary of? #UFchat
11:46 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Separating the undead from the living, if you were to use CS or CN gas, only the undead would be able to stay put. #UFchat
11:47 pm UF_Chat: Q12c: What kind of supernatural/UF crowds would you like to see/explore? #UFchat
11:47 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Or to expose the fakers. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:48 pm UF_Chat: Q13: How might a mole and/or plant be used in a shopping crowd to cause trouble for a UF MC? #UFchat
11:48 pm J_GriffinB: @JLCoburn I was also thinking a cult targeting particular persons for sacrifice or vamps needing AB blood or the like. #UFchat
11:49 pm UF_Chat: Q14: What are the motivating forces (beyond money) of ?normal? everyday crowds? #UFchat
11:49 pm shadowflame1974: Q13 rumors and spying on the MC or perhaps hinting to the MC that he/she needs to be somewhere(Stuck in the crowd) #ufchat
11:49 pm AuthorWilliam: A14: Security #ufchat
11:49 pm UF_Chat: Q15: When does greed as a motivating force no longer work in a crowd? Does it ever go away entirely? #UFchat
11:50 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam By security – do you mean safety/survival? #UFchat
11:50 pm JLCoburn: A14: Think about where you see major crowds. Work commutes, lunch time, parties, concerts, popular street exhibitions. #ufchat
11:50 pm MarciSischo: I expect the majority of the crowd would give up on greed if their lives were in danger. #UFChat
11:50 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Or information/protection? #UFchat
11:50 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A14, Sporting events, fandom of any kind. Fun to have shit break out at an SF convention or the like. #UFchat
11:51 pm MarciSischo: But you’d still have some die-hards who’d stick with greed even if the sky were coming down. #UFChat
11:51 pm UF_Chat: @MarciSischo Yet people still go back to Black Friday sales where deaths/violence have happened – 😦 #UFchat
11:51 pm J_GriffinB: the crowd doesn’t run in fear, instead throwing themselves in the way, screaming “FEED FROM ME, YOU STUD!” #UFchat
11:51 pm UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB That WOULD be fun! (So much potential) #UFchat
11:52 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Or information/protection? <Yes survival, sorry, not the guys/gals with badges and ID’s πŸ™‚ #ufchat
11:52 pm UF_Chat: Q16: What changes a crowd into a mob? What are the differences? Do all mobs need ?instigators/trouble-stirrers?? #UFchat
11:52 pm JLCoburn: @MarciSischo True, there will always be someone willing to risk it to profit from the chaos. #ufchat
11:52 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB OMG. *dies laughing* That would be frickin’ fantastic! #UFChat
11:52 pm UF_Chat: Q16a: What might be some differences in having supernaturals in a crowd-turned-mob vs 100% humans only? #UFchat
11:52 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Let’s you play with tropes, clichΓ©s. #UFchat
11:53 pm JLCoburn: @AuthorWilliam Another security issue could be someone with an alter ego. All it would take is one telepath in the crowd to find em #ufchat
11:53 pm UF_Chat: Q16b: Would martial law be effective against supernatural mobs/groups/takeovers? #UFchat
11:53 pm shadowflame1974: Q16 mob is more a collective mental state. Crowds can be groups of individual Mob would have the same mindset or goal #ufchat
11:53 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Or an instance of outraged emotion visited upon a significant group. #UFchat
11:54 pm MarciSischo: A16: Would depend on the situation, kind of Supes involved, etc, I’d think. #UFChat
11:54 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat In the US? Unequivically, no. We haven’t the capacity to deal with evacuation, let alone locking down populations. #UFchat
11:54 pm UF_Chat: @JLCoburn One telepath makes all the difference.. πŸ˜‰ (Gotta hand Ms. Harris props 4 having premise in her books – lots potential) #UFchat
11:55 pm JLCoburn: A16b: Only if the supernatural powers were already taken into consideration by law enforcement. They would have no way to outfit an #ufchat
11:55 pm UF_Chat: Q16c: How is ?The Mob? different from ?a mob?? Examples of The Mob (& similar orgs.) used in UF? #UFchat
11:55 pm JLCoburn: A16b: entire police force in a short amount of time to deal with supernatural threats. #ufchat
11:55 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB I dunno. We can do it on a small scale, like the CDC will do. Might have more trouble on a larger scale, tho. #UFChat
11:55 pm UF_Chat: [egs @Cameron_Haley?s Mob Rules, @hollyblack?s White Cat ? links to their books included at end] #UFchat
11:56 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo I’d argue that it cannot be done. Look at Katrina. #UFchat
11:56 pm UF_Chat: Q17: Are there any creatures that can influence a crowd/group? How do they/might they do it? #UFchat
11:56 pm JLCoburn: @J_GriffinB Plus US only thinks about evacuation, not containment. Just look at bomb procedures in the airports. Evacuate 2k+ people #ufchat
11:56 pm UF_Chat: Q17a: Are there any crowd-influencing creatures used as MCs in UF? Are they generally benevolent or evil? #UFchat
11:57 pm J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo And we have very limited proof the CDC would be able to handle any significant outbreak. #UFchat
11:57 pm UF_Chat: [Note: Kelly Gay uses Sirens, as do Cat Adams (2 author team), various UF has necromancers controlling zombies/vamps] #UFchat
11:57 pm MarciSischo: @J_GriffinB Yeah, they made a mess of that one. They do better with small towns. Did it in Arizona for that Hunta virus outbreak. #UFChat
11:57 pm UF_Chat: S: Patricia Briggs? use of Marrock (ultimate alpha werewolf) has ?pack power? ? able to control/influence pack THROUGH pack. #UFchat
11:57 pm JLCoburn: A17: Any creature significantly larger than the individual or several individuals typically incite fear and thus can control. #ufchat
11:58 pm J_GriffinB: @JLCoburn It’s because even Martial Law requires an order from someone setting a curfew and otherwise limiting freedoms. #UFchat
11:58 pm UF_Chat: Going to Q20 with some sub questions if y’all can hang in there – creature feature time now! #UFchat
11:58 pm JLCoburn: A17: As for non-supernatural, look how well horses work during Mardi Gras. #ufchat
11:58 pm J_GriffinB: Which will be poitical suicide for any general who contemplates it, let alone goes with it, regardless of necessity. #UFchat
11:59 pm UF_Chat: Q18: Are there any other UF groups/creatures that use crowds/groups to build draw their power from? #UFchat
11:59 pm MarciSischo: Necromancer. Undead hordes FTW, y’all. #UFChat
11:59 pm JLCoburn: A18: Psychic vampires feed off the energy of others/crowds. (Yes, I was a part of Sanguinarium. Why do you ask?) #ufchat
November 28, 2010
UF_Chat: @JLCoburn Was talking to someone other day about how horses cannot be beat for law enforcement in many situations. Hard on them tho. #UFchat
UF_Chat: Q18a: What might be some other ways in which crowds could be used supernaturally? #UFchat
UF_Chat: Q18b: Think of herds, flocks & human mimicking of this behavior. Potential of this concept in UF? (beyond weresheep!) #UFchat
J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat And their riders. Lots of injuries. #UFchat
12:01 am UF_Chat: Q18c: What are some supernatural creatures that tend to work/exist in strong knit groups? How might they be used in UF crowd scenes? #UFchat
12:01 am J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Turn out the vote. #UFchat
12:01 am UF_Chat: 2 Questions left! #UFchat
12:01 am JLCoburn: @UF_Chat Flocks? The Birds. Think of the panic a large group could incite if they start divebombing. #ufchat
12:01 am UF_Chat: Q19: Considering supernatural in UF, faith referred to. What are potential situations faith/religious/church groups could be used? #UFchat
12:02 am MarciSischo: Covens and wolf packs come to mind. #UFChat
12:02 am J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat 18C: A faerie ring should always have its court, no? #UFchat
12:02 am MarciSischo: Just saw Torchwood: Children of Earth last night. Chanting crowds of kids = creepy, btw. #UFChat
12:02 am J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat A19: Elf, Santa’s sleigh powered by belief. #UFchat
12:02 am AuthorWilliam: RT @UF_Chat: Q19: Considering supernatural in UF, faith referred to. What are potential situations faith/religious/church groups could be used? #UFchat
12:02 am UF_Chat: @JLCoburn You notice that movie was never really resolved… the problem didn’t go away. (Love that movie) #UFchat
12:03 am JLCoburn: A19: Mass sacrifice to the Elder Gods! #ufchat
12:03 am AuthorWilliam: A19 Where do we start? lol #ufchat
12:03 am J_GriffinB: @MarciSischo Especially when they are chanting for your death or the death of a class of people. #UFchat
12:03 am UF_Chat: @J_GriffinB Yes! And you think they’d do a whole lot more than look pretty… #UFchat
12:03 am MarciSischo: @JLCoburn Ia! Ia! Cthulu f’tagn! #UFChat
12:04 am UF_Chat: @JLCoburn Did you see HBO’s True Blood Season 2? (essentially went there) #UFchat
12:04 am MarciSischo: @JLCoburn *ahem* Sorry. πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
12:04 am AuthorWilliam: In UF the supernatural can sometime seamlessly be connected to faith groups because of the many fantastic beliefs. #ufchat
12:04 am JLCoburn: @UF_Chat No, no cable. Still need to start True Blood from the begining. #ufchat
12:05 am AuthorWilliam: A church group in UF could BE the supernatural group hidden in plain sight. #ufchat
12:05 am shadowflame1974: I’ll see True Blood one of these days I guess #ufchat
12:05 am MarciSischo: @AuthorWilliam Ooo, that could be a neat idea. #UFChat
12:06 am shadowflame1974: @AuthorWilliam that is very true. how much difference between faith and magic? #ufchat
12:06 am TopTv_Shows: RT @shadowflame1974 – I’ll see True Blood one of these days I guess #ufchat
12:06 am AuthorWilliam: A church group and be the lone band of rebels in an oppressed UF society or the dictators. #ufchat
12:06 am JLCoburn: @MarciSischo And I meant you had my adoration with the Necromancer line #ufchat
12:06 am J_GriffinB: @AuthorWilliam Princess of Wands by John Ringo has some very interesting takes on faith as a weapon against evil paranormals. #UFchat
12:06 am MarciSischo: @JLCoburn LOL! Thanks! Undead hordes: the answer to all your problems. #UFChat
12:07 am AuthorWilliam: A UF story could parallel a schism where light and dark sides of the same religion divide and become hostile. #ufchat
12:07 am inkgypsy: FINAL Q20: Crowds ?easy to consider bad potential. What are possible GOOD crowd scenes UF style? (powers, creatures, be creative!) #UFchat
12:08 am inkgypsy: Hey people in #UFchat I think I got kicked off as the mod. 😦 Last parts via the REAL me. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
12:08 am MarciSischo: A20: Crowd turns on bad guy, like in the Spiderman movies. #UFChat
12:08 am inkgypsy: S: Recent video/performance art brought smile to many faces using ?flash mobs? (random strangers join in ?spontaneous? dance/scene). #UFchat
12:08 am J_GriffinB: @inkgypsy A20: Using the power of a church group to heal someone, some rift between worlds? #UFchat
12:08 am shadowflame1974: @AuthorWilliam I have something similar in one of my short stories not all worked out though still revising #ufchat
12:08 am AuthorWilliam: @shadowflame1974 There’s a lot of room to explore that relationship especially in a fantasy or UF landscape. #ufchat
12:09 am inkgypsy: That?s a wrap for #UFchat today! Resources & some extras on crowds, mobs, innocent (& not-so-much) bystanders coming up.
12:09 am inkgypsy: Got a topic you want to chat about? Let me know! (@inkgypsy) I?ll add it to the list & maybe even bump up the chat-date for it. #UFchat
12:09 am inkgypsy: Some additional resources on crowd control, mob mentality, people packs & collateral damage in next few tweets: #UFchat
12:09 am J_GriffinB: A20 I should have said religious group. #UFchat
12:09 am shadowflame1974: @AuthorWilliam I agree. Huge amount of room to explore. #ufchat
12:09 am AuthorWilliam: @shadowflame1974 My debut novel is a fantasy with UF elements that has a primary theme of faith vs. religion. It’s ripe territory. #ufchat
12:09 am inkgypsy: Today’s primer for #UFchat early birds was: That Horrible Crowd! http://bit.ly/hQhVGG #UFchat
12:10 am JLCoburn: A20: A riot ends up taking out a dictator and putting someone that should be in power on the proverbial throne. #ufchat
12:10 am shadowflame1974: @AuthorWilliam *ads to read list* πŸ˜€ #ufchat
12:10 am inkgypsy: @AuthorWilliam (psst – pimp now! And tell people why UF peeps want to read it!) πŸ™‚ #UFchat
12:10 am inkgypsy: The Monsters Are Due on Maple Street (Twilight Zone episode discussion where crowds are key) http://bit.ly/dP1vs6 #UFchat
12:10 am inkgypsy: Mobsourcing: A Term I?ve Been Needing http://bit.ly/ePYZIm #UFchat
12:10 am MarciSischo: @AuthorWilliam Linkage? Name of book? #UFChat
12:10 am inkgypsy: Crowd Management Safety Guidelines for Retailers http://bit.ly/bG0nXj #UFchat
12:11 am shadowflame1974: @JLCoburn or puts in some one who shouldn’t be ruling on the throne! #ufchat
12:11 am inkgypsy: Crowd Management Strategies – Safety Laws that Work http://bit.ly/gitF6d #UFchat
12:11 am inkgypsy: Riot control (Wkipedia) http://bit.ly/gPENBi #UFchat
12:12 am J_GriffinB: The Last Captain, the novel I just submitted; opens with a riot scene, and though it isn’t UF, it is Urban, and SF. #UFchat
12:12 am AuthorWilliam: I am actually in the middle of a BLACK FRIDAY WEEKEND promotion. Signed copies, free shipping+discount #ufchat
12:13 am inkgypsy: Flash mobs (Wikipedia) http://bit.ly/18RBg9 & eg. Freeze http://youtu.be/jwMj3PJDxuo & Sound of Music http://youtu.be/7EYAUazLI9k #ufchat
12:13 am JLCoburn: Side note, anyone that needs help with law enforcement riot control feel free to message me. I try to be a helpful one. #ufchat
12:13 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB USF then hunh πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
12:13 am inkgypsy: Martial Law (by country) (Wikipedia) http://bit.ly/d8XIcT #UFchat #ufchat
12:13 am inkgypsy: Holly Black (@hollyblack) Talks About ?White Cat? (UF novel with magic organized crime) http://bit.ly/eVLuGj #ufchat
12:13 am inkgypsy: Cameron Haley?s (@Cameron_Haley) The Underworld Cycle (Bk 1: Mob Rules ? LA in the midst of an occult gang war) http://bit.ly/fUtGVd #ufchat
12:13 am larissa_sarah: RT @inkgypsy: Holly Black (@hollyblack) Talks About ?White Cat? (UF novel with magic organized crime) http://bit.ly/eVLuGj #ufchat
12:13 am inkgypsy: ?True Blood and Philosophy? ? Ch10 Let the Bon Temps Roll: Sacrifice, Scapegoats & Good Times http://bit.ly/gg7daU (preview) #ufchat
12:14 am shadowflame1974: RT @JLCoburn: Side note, anyone that needs help with law enforcement riot control feel free to message me. I try to be a helpful one #ufchat
12:14 am inkgypsy: #UFchat transcript available on the #UFchat blog in 48hrs-ish, allowing for late comments. Just use the hashtag. ? #ufchat
12:14 am AuthorWilliam: Visit http://www.darkprovince.com – The so called “Dark Province” has modern elements compared to MC’s homeland #ufchat
12:14 am inkgypsy: Many thanks once again to the awesome @shadowflame1974 for her help today! #UFchat #ufchat
12:14 am MarciSischo: Good chat! Thanks, all! πŸ˜€ #UFChat
12:14 am shadowflame1974: @inkgypsy always welcome! #ufchat
12:15 am inkgypsy: Happy shopping season everyone! Watch your wallets and your backs & we?ll see you next week. πŸ˜‰ ? @UF_Chat lights out. #ufchat
12:15 am shadowflame1974: Thanks for the discussion today folks! Hope to see you all next week #ufchat
12:15 am inkgypsy: @MarciSischo Thanks for participating today! Very fun! Be safe & see you next week we hope. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
12:17 am inkgypsy: It appears I twweted too much as the #UFchat mod? How annoying – will need to set up a second ‘overflow’ account for just in cases… blerg.
12:17 am AuthorWilliam: Bravo @inkgypsy! {applause} #ufchat
12:18 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 A bit, though it’s told from the point of view of military and civilian police officers, criminals, & agents POVs. #UFchat
12:19 am J_GriffinB: I am LE, and have stood on the line many a time, so feel free to DM any questions you might have. #UFchat
12:20 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB so more of a switching in the POV? most UF is strictly first or third with tight POV #ufchat
12:20 am inkgypsy: @J_GriffinB Now why don’t we see that more? There are places/groups (all over world, diff religions) that do that right now! #UFchat
12:20 am JLCoburn: @J_GriffinB Hey, now I know were to go if I forget something or something seems off . #ufchat
12:21 am inkgypsy: RT @AuthorWilliam: @shadowflame1974 My debut novel is a fantasy with UF elements that has a primary theme of faith vs. religion. It’s ripe territory. #ufchat
12:22 am shadowflame1974: @JLCoburn looking for BetaReaders? #ufchat
12:23 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 Oh, my POVs are tight. I just (rather stupidly, as far as work-load goes) didn’t restrict myself to one or two… #UFchat
12:23 am LdyDisney: @inkgypsy You did a great job!!! *clapping* #UFchat
12:24 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB oh that’s okay. First novel had 9 or so? *shivers at thoughts on revisions* #ufchat
12:24 am JLCoburn: @shadowflame1974 Still a ways off from that. Will keep you in mind though. #ufchat
12:24 am shadowflame1974: @JLCoburn Cool! πŸ˜€ #ufchat
12:25 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 I have eight, though the timeline is a straight shot. #UFchat
12:26 am J_GriffinB: My agent has it, should send it this week. #UFchat
12:26 am LdyDisney: Last minute promo… Please vote for Moonlight in the Writing with the Stars contest… http://bit.ly/bL9B86 PR/UF crossover! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
12:27 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB well mine has a few plotholes that need bulldozer so..I’ll fix them later after I get through the series I am working on #ufchat
12:28 am Patti_OShea: RT @LdyDisney: Last minute promo… Please vote for Moonlight in the Writing with the Stars contest… http://bit.ly/bL9B86 PR/UF crossover! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
12:29 am J_GriffinB: You can see a few excerpts at http://therantinggriffin.blogspot.com/2010/08/snippet-from-last-captain.html #UFchat
12:29 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 good luck! #UFchat
12:30 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB *takes a look* #ufchat
12:31 am shadowflame1974: @J_GriffinB Nice grabs you right away. #ufchat
12:31 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 There are more, just run a search for The Last Captain on the blog. #UFchat
12:32 am J_GriffinB: @shadowflame1974 Thanks. Thanks very much. #UFchat
12:53 am JLCoburn: To all my new followers (particularly from #UFChat) I am random, odd, and happy to have you. If I forget to follow back just @ me.
4:25 am hollyblack: RT @inkgypsy: Holly Black (@hollyblack) Talks About ?White Cat? (UF novel with magic organized crime) http://bit.ly/eVLuGj #ufchat
4:46 am EllenKushner: RT @inkgypsy: Holly Black (@hollyblack) Talks About ?White Cat? (UF novel with magic organized crime) http://bit.ly/eVLuGj #ufchat
6:12 am inkgypsy: @MorrigansWitch Hey! Sorry missed this earlier. #UFchat is urban fantasy chat for writers & readers. All welcome every Sat 3pmPST. πŸ™‚
8:35 am AnassaRh: A: In event of zombies, I’ve enough food for several weeks. That should buy me time to cobble together weapons of some sort ? #ufchat
8:36 am AnassaRh: ? at which point, I could get more food and maybe find smart people to be with, ones who’ve seen zombie films. #ufchat
8:38 am AnassaRh: A1: Concerts and other public/cultural events. Protests. Teen parties that get out of control. #ufchat
8:42 am AnassaRh: A1a: Theatres, amusement parks, planes, trains, other forms of transportation. #ufchat
8:44 am AnassaRh: A1b: Schools, public memorials and monuments, major sporting event locations (said as Vancouveite). #ufchat
8:49 am AnassaRh: A2: No spec. scenes come to mind, but have parties, proms, rallies, malls, mobs all used effectively. Parties, proms for busy-ness? #ufchat
8:50 am AnassaRh: A2: ? Rallies for ability to inspire or inspire terror. Mobs for the same. And malls to convey frenzy or separate people. #ufchat
8:55 am gavreads: RT @inkgypsy: Holly Black (@hollyblack) Talks About ?White Cat? (UF novel with magic organized crime) http://bit.ly/eVLuGj #ufchat
9:02 am AnassaRh: A2a: Crowds swarm. They think collectively; the individual disappears. People can do stupid, horrible things because of the mood. #ufchat
9:03 am AnassaRh: A2a: At same time, crowds can be composed of individuals all trying to be alone as much as possible. Leads to ignored surroundings. #ufchat
9:03 am AnassaRh: A2a: I think people become more animalistic, in crowds. #ufchat
9:05 am AnassaRh: A3: I remember a couple supportive crowds of allies. Lilith Saintcrow had one sent out to cover more ground than MC could. #ufchat
9:06 am AnassaRh: There’s also the market scene in Neverwhere, that’s used to set the stage for the hidden world and introduce a few characters. #ufchat
9:09 am AnassaRh: A4: Crowds of allies: brainstorming, more people hunting. Crowds of enemies: turn them on themselves, use mass stupidity to get info #ufchat
9:10 am AnassaRh: Crowds of neutrals: cause panic to delay enemies, use as barrier or hiding place, get a feel for public sentiment/awareness. #ufchat
9:13 am AnassaRh: A4a: Crowds are an easy way to trap or expose someone, or to drive a point home re: isolation, not belonging, dangerousness powers #ufchat
9:13 am AnassaRh: RT @JLCoburn: A4a: Hampering movement. Giving a villain a way to hide or distract the MC. Perfect setting to relieve the MC of something valuable. #ufchat
9:16 am AnassaRh: A5: Bad customer service on Black Friday (or other weekends) could turn a crowd. Long waits. Lack of stock. A Grinch. #ufchat
9:17 am AnassaRh: A5: In more UF terms, a grandstanding antag who knows what they’re doing could sway a crowd quickly. Or an arranged spectacle. #ufchat
9:23 am AnassaRh: A5a: For good: show MC as hero in positively charged environment (or antag as bad in same). Show urgency of situation. #ufchat
9:24 am AnassaRh: Can imagine situation: MC new in town, contacts local UF law enforcement. Depending on pitch, need, etc., could go either way. #ufchat
9:26 am AnassaRh: A5a: For bad: Well, if MC drops in on crowd of antags? πŸ˜„ Or if you gave them something to focus anger on. (Could help/hinder) #ufchat
9:30 am AnassaRh: A5b: Exposure to supernatural = questioning our knowledge, existence of God; existential crises; paranoia and fear, polarization. #ufchat
9:31 am AnassaRh: A5b: If supernatural irrevocably exposed, then everyone needs to cope with that. New rules, new laws, new hierarchies. Turmoil! #ufchat
9:36 am AnassaRh: A5c: Collateral: kids, seniors, small/frail people, salespeople. Anyone without ability to defend or keep up, goes down. #ufchat
9:38 am AnassaRh: And salespeople are could bear brunt of anger, try to stop the mob, be conditioned not to fight. #ufchat
9:42 am AnassaRh: A5d: Anyone could be hit by a spell, moving quickly, in wrong direction, in front of target. Epileptics? Anyone can -> clawed/bitten #ufchat
9:42 am AnassaRh: RT @JLCoburn: And just think if the MC instigates a crowd to get away from an Antag, then finds out later that a child was trampled. Guilt anyone? #ufchat
9:48 am AnassaRh: A6a: If I was a cop in a world with magic, would want to have magical talent (and prepped spells?) on my team. #ufchat
9:50 am AnassaRh: Silver, garlic, stakes: yes. Also salt, since it’s got a number of applications, and a blowtorch? #watchestoomuchSupernatural #ufchat
9:51 am AnassaRh: If there was a way to enchant clothes/vests/armor, or give magical boost to enforcers, I’d probably want that too. #ufchat
9:54 am AnassaRh: A8: Online connections would spread word faster, allow greater range of research, contacts. Rare demon? There’s a forum. Also an app #ufchat
9:55 am AnassaRh: A8: Magic hacking (or hacking in general). Vamps esp. seem to have business sense, which means websites. MC/antag could have blog. #ufchat
9:57 am AnassaRh: Seems like, if you alert the right people (BoingBoing?), world knows w/in hours. Good way to embarrass/destroy/frighten?or get help. #ufchat
9:59 am AnassaRh: Ooh,so if u know where 2 dig, closed becomes open?RT@Shevdon:?more difficult in closed world-Internet is persistent record of events #UFchat
10:00 am AnassaRh: Or to make a damning vid viral? RT @ajackwriting: A8 You could use the internet/social media to discredit a damning video as a fake. #UFchat
10:02 am AnassaRh: Since we’re in the middle of UF/web interface talk, taking moment to rec WebMage series. Hacker descended from Fates, spells as code #ufchat
10:06 am AnassaRh: A10: Someone earlier mentioned MC drawing on crowd energy for power. Lots of potential there. Blanking otherwise. 😦 #ufchat
10:09 am AnassaRh: A12: Well, there’s certainly potential for modern-day “torch+pitchfork vs. paranormal” encounters. #ufchat
10:09 am AnassaRh: And a crowd of vamps/witches/baddies could hold a crowd in thrall, weaponize them, use them as spies. #ufchat
10:10 am AnassaRh: A12a: Don’t see why they’d have to be. Lycanthropy could have arisen several places, several ways. So yes to “racist” battles. #ufchat
10:12 am AnassaRh: A12b: I’d definitely be wary of those thrall crowds I just mentioned. And hives and packs, of course. Or pantheons ? #ufchat
10:13 am AnassaRh: A12c: Actually, it would be neat to see more whole pantheons at work, rather than just a god or two. And maybe an imp swarm? #ufchat
10:15 am AnassaRh: A13: Relaying location and activities to antag, or causing delays in aisles or lines, so MC is stuck there longer. #ufchat
10:17 am AnassaRh: RT @JLCoburn: @AuthorWilliam Another security issue could be someone with an alter ego. All it would take is one telepath in the crowd to find em #ufchat
10:19 am AnassaRh: A16: Mobs have anger, focus. I don’t think they need an instigator if there’s a very, very clear enemy. See: Cooks Source. #ufchat
10:21 am AnassaRh: A16a: Presence of supes in a mob would up the danger, fear, and potential for chaos. And if vamps, and someone bleeds, beware. #ufchat
10:22 am AnassaRh: Or if weres turn not for moon, but heightened emotion? And again, psychic feeding, ambient magic, or mind control could be in play. #ufchat
10:24 am AnassaRh: Q16c: The Mob isn’t a crowd. It’s an organization, a business. It has a political agenda. It’s individuals, following orders? #ufchat
10:25 am AnassaRh: Q16c: ? and therefore there’s potential for disobedience of a kind you don’t see in a mob. #ufchat
10:28 am AnassaRh: A17: No specifics come to mind, but anything that can cause hallucinations or make things “appear”, could be great at crowd control. #ufchat
10:31 am AnassaRh: Folklore via Pratchett: Can control people thru hair, skin, etc. If you raid a hairdresser’s garbage, you can create a crowd. #ufchat
10:37 am AnassaRh: A18b: Insects and arachnids would cause chaos. If supernaturals have an animal phobia/superstition? #ufchat
10:39 am AnassaRh: Ooh! RT@AuthorWilliam: A UF story could parallel a schism where light and dark sides of the same religion divide and become hostile. #ufchat
10:42 am AnassaRh: A19: Religious holidays. KKK-type activities. Religion as repository of info, as Watcher Council with purpose twisted or forgotten. #ufchat
10:42 am AnassaRh: A19: Naturally, any religion that involves god or demon summoning could feature, but that’s been done. Lots. #ufchat
10:44 am AnassaRh: A19: Church or faith could be something the MC turns to in crisis, or is part of daily routine. Many MC atheist/agnostic, no? #ufchat
10:48 am AnassaRh: And that’s it for me and #ufchat tonight, I think. Sorry for the Twitter spam! G’night, all.
11:51 am shevdon: @inkgypsy Thanks, I enjoyed the #ufchat. A bit late for me, though, midnight here. Will try and join next wk. Cheers
November 30, 2010
12:18 am UF_Chat: Aiming to get #UFchat transcript on mob mentalities & other dangers of shopping UF-style up today. Use hashtag to have yur comment included!
12:18 am inkgypsy: Aiming to get #UFchat transcript on mob mentalities & other dangers of shopping UF-style up today. Use hashtag to have yur comment included!
12:25 am inkgypsy: @leapetra Oh please link us! (story that would have fit with #UFchat) I’ll include it so everyone knows where to find it. πŸ™‚
12:54 am inkgypsy: A Black Fri UF story! Perfect for last wks #UFchat. RT @leapetra http://bit.ly/gAsPXS It features my characters dealing with Black Friday



Happy crazy-season to all! Stay safe and remember ‘most’ bargains aren’t worth risking your life and soul for – especially if the dealer is a slick talking character, standing at the crossroads, fiddle in hand… πŸ˜‰

Stay tuned to @UF_Chat on Twitter for countdowns and updates.

See you next week!

Gypsy (@inkgypsy)


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