#UFchat – chat for urban fantasy writers

Archive for August, 2010

Transcript for August 28, 2010: Roasting the UF Genre – Pet Peeves & Wish Lists (Round 1)

Today was so busy we decided we’d continue with Round 2 next week. Some good meaty discussion today – both on the positives of UF as well as the cliches and what people think needs to change.

Writers especially will find this one a useful resource. πŸ™‚

TODAY’S TOPIC: UF – The Good, the Bad & the Untapped: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves & Wish Lists

Big thanks today to @Abigail_ATUF for permission to use the catchy β€˜Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves’ phrase.

VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: 1 hr till #UFchat! The UF genre customer complaints window is open! Bring pet peeves & other monsters for skewering & roasting. 3pm PST
9:27 pm UF_Chat: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article When Things Go Wrong by Carrie Vaughan http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #UFchat
9:27 pm inkgypsy: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article When Things Go Wrong by Carrie Vaughan http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #UFchat
9:34 pm marirandomities: RT @inkgypsy: for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article When Things Go Wrong by Carrie Vaughan http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #ufchat
9:35 pm MindyRuiz: RT @UF_Chat: Primer 4 #UFchat early birds: please take a look @ article When Things Go Wrong by Carrie Vaughan http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #UFchat
9:44 pm tadbo: RT @UF_Chat: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please look at article When Things Go Wrong by Carrie Vaughan http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #UFchat
9:45 pm UF_Chat: 15 mins till #UFchat! Going to go file my teeth to sharper points. Tearing into UF genre pet peeves. Should get good & gory… πŸ˜‰ 3pm PST
9:45 pm inkgypsy: 15 mins till #UFchat! Going to go file my teeth to sharper points. Tearing into UF genre pet peeves. Should get good & gory… πŸ˜‰ 3pm PST
9:51 pm leapetra: Honey the cat might be joining me on #ufchat. She wants to sit between me and the screen all of a sudden.
9:54 pm shadowflame1974: RT @inkgypsy: 15 mins till #UFchat! Going to go file my teeth to sharper points. Tearing into UF genre pet peeves. Should get good & gory… πŸ˜‰ 3pm PST
9:54 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: #UFChat My blog is has the US cover for my book 2 and the UK cover for book 1 http://temporarilysignificant.blogspot.com/ Pos. relevent.
9:58 pm UF_Chat: It?s a goggles & pointy-weapons day today in #UFchat! We?re scrutinizing clichΓ©s, poking standards & pushing boundaries. Come armed. #UFchat
9:59 pm HC_Palmquist: RT @UF_Chat: It?s a goggles & pointy-weapons day today in #UFchat! We?re scrutinizing clichΓ©s, poking standards & pushing boundaries. Come armed. #UFchat
9:59 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @inkgypsy Try this http://bit.ly/cBbdRp and http://bit.ly/cHXrrB #ufchat
9:59 pm inkgypsy: Changing to my other identity as #UFchat mod – boots, goggles, teeth & spork ready for dissection today! i minute to go!
10:00 pm UF_Chat: 3, 2… and we are now live with #UFchat! What do you love, what are you sick of, what do you want more of? Pet Peeves & Wish Lists today!
10:00 pm leapetra: Made it! #ufchat
10:00 pm rcmurphy: RT @UF_Chat: It?s a goggles & pointy-weapons day today in #UFchat! We?re scrutinizing clichΓ©s, poking standards & pushing boundaries. Come armed. #UFchat
10:00 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: #UFChat I love saturday night!
10:00 pm UF_Chat: Hello everyone! We’re live and happening. Join in – bring your complaints – on forks please. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:00 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat can we stop with the leather bound women on the covers #ufchat
10:01 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: #UFChat Peeves: Flat Earth Athiests http://bit.ly/9Ecdqh , wangst http://bit.ly/9yIoBR and vangst (which is vampires wangsting).
10:01 pm UF_Chat: @rcmurphy I can see you! Yay! #UFchat
10:01 pm UF_Chat: TODAY?S TOPIC: UF – The Good, the Bad & the Untapped: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves & Wish Lists #UFchat
10:01 pm editorialdept: RT UF_Chat: It?s a pointy-weapons day today in #UFchat! We?re scrutinizing clichΓ©s, poking standards & pushing boundaries. Come armed.
10:01 pm UF_Chat: Big thanks today to @Abigail_ATUF for permission to use the catchy ?Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves? phrase. ? #UFchat
10:01 pm Cameron_Haley: Hi again, all. Looking forward to this one. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: We all know there R typical hallmarks of genres as well as evolving trends. Let?s consider the UF genre where it is ?now? mid-2010. #UFchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley *waves* #UFchat
10:02 pm HC_Palmquist: @UF_Chat I came with my sharp, pointy…sharp-thingie….yeah, I just woke up, okay? #UFchat
10:02 pm amandabonilla: Hi all! This should be an interesting discussion! #ufchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: Urban fantasy has lots of variety & draws a lot of diff. reader (& writer!) types. Let?s start positive. Q: what do you really LOVE? #UFchat
10:03 pm miranda00writes: @leapetra Aside from being on every freakin’ cover, leather doesn’t seem a practical clothing choice, particularly in warm climates #UFCHAT
10:03 pm rcmurphy: @UF_Chat Yay! But I have to work on my historical romance today. *pout* No #UFchat for me. Will read the transcript next week. Have fun.
10:03 pm Cameron_Haley: My biggest pet peeve is when people say “All urban fantasy is just ________.” So be warned! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:03 pm UF_Chat: @HC_Palmquist Mr Pointy? Yeah – know what you mean. πŸ˜‰ (That’s a Buffy reference for all you naughty minded people!) #UFchat
10:03 pm shadowflame1974: Yea the leather-clad woman is a bit old. #UFchat
10:03 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat The genre is wide open, you can write about dragons in Nascar if you want #ufchat
10:03 pm HC_Palmquist: @UF_Chat I love the ability to immerse paranormal into the modern world. To use the familiar but make it weird. #UFchat
10:03 pm amandabonilla: I LOVE strong heroines. The sword-weilding, ass-kicking kind! #ufchat
10:03 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Urban fantasy has lots of variety & draws a lot of diff. types. Let?s start positive. Q: what do you really LOVE? #UFchat
10:04 pm UF_Chat: Here’s you’re chance to show your love for UF – soften them up and THEN we get out the teeth.. πŸ˜€ #UFchat
10:04 pm shadowflame1974: @miranda00writes #UFChat only place it seems fitting is bikers and cowboys
10:04 pm editorialdept: I love that UF is essentially “real world plus”. It’s things as we know it plus a nice kick of the unknown. #ufchat
10:04 pm amandabonilla: I love the integration of real-life, here and now with the fantastical. #ufchat
10:05 pm VampBookClub: Absolutely. RT @HC_Palmquist: I love the ability to immerse paranormal into the modern world. To use the familiar but make it weird. #UFchat
10:05 pm UF_Chat: I love our world with a twist… and not-afraid to show love for weapons girls. πŸ™‚ (and the boys who comes to respect that) #UFchat
10:05 pm UF_Chat: RT @editorialdept: I love that UF is essentially “real world plus”. Its things as we know it plus a nice kick of the unknown. #UFchat
10:05 pm amandabonilla: @shadowflame1974 haha! You should read JR Ward’s Black Dagger Brotherhood series! Lots of men in leather! YUM #ufchat
10:05 pm miranda00writes: Love the idea that world is a more fantastical than it appears to be #UFchat
10:05 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I liked early Dresden’s private eye schtick. #UFChat
10:06 pm amandabonilla: RT @UF_Chat: I love our world with a twist… and not-afraid to show love for weapons girls. πŸ™‚ (and the boys who comes to respect that) #UFchat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: @miranda00writes Gotta love the just around the corner stuff! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: Time to pull out the big guns. Will tweet aspect & you tell me: what?s good, what?s bad, what?s ugly & what would be great to see! #UFchat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: First a general question before we focus on some areas: Q: what are your UF pet peeves? #UFchat
10:06 pm editorialdept: Most readers I know love to daydream and good UF fits right into that “what if?” daydream. #ufchat
10:06 pm Cameron_Haley: I love modern twists on old legends, creatures and characters I’m familiar with but can discover in a new way. #UFchat
10:07 pm UF_Chat: @Ben_Aaronovitch (Me too – love the whole detective noir thing) #UFchat
10:07 pm leapetra: The strong women types are great, but like that blog post said, only one strong woman #ufchat
10:07 pm marirandomities: Oh yeah. The covers are my greatest peeves. RT @leapetra: @UF_Chat can we stop with the leather bound women on the covers #ufchat
10:07 pm shadowflame1974: @amandabonilla on my wish list πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:07 pm amandabonilla: I also think UF allows for a story to evolve around a more than capable female. Not a damsel in distress #ufchat
10:08 pm LadyinGray: Hey,all! #ufchat newbie here. I’ve only got a few minutes before dinner guests arrive.
10:08 pm HC_Palmquist: @UF_Chat My biggest UF pet peeve is when the female heroine doesn’t have weaknesses or flaws. #UFchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley You’re speaking my language! (love mythology, folklore & the gritty old world fairy tales) UF = contemp equivalent #UFchat
10:08 pm leapetra: @marirandomities and the headless women, why crop their heads off? #ufchat
10:08 pm SpiceBites: I love that the women don’t wait around to be rescued and the men aren’t intimidated in #UFchat
10:08 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat that there is almost always some romantic aspect to the stories. yea, RW has a lot of it, but always?
10:08 pm HC_Palmquist: @LadyinGray Welcome and jump in as much as you can. What’s for dinner? #UFchat
10:08 pm amandabonilla: @LadyinGray *waves* HI! πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:08 pm editorialdept: Peeve – brooding, sullen, but oh-so-irresistable characters. We get it – immotality/shapeshifting’s a drag. YAWN. #ufchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: FYI We’ll be looking at 2 aspects today 1) the UF image (includes marketing) & 2) the stories/content #UFchat
10:08 pm Satin420: RT @leapetra: The strong women types are great, but like that blog post said, only one strong woman #ufchat
10:09 pm HC_Palmquist: RT @editorialdept: Peeve – brooding, sullen, but oh-so-irresistable characters. We get it – immotality/shapeshifting’s a drag. YAWN. #ufchat
10:09 pm VampBookClub: Often in UF we get one strong woman, but several strong men. Would it be so bad to have multiple badass women in a single novel? #ufchat
10:09 pm UF_Chat: @LadyinGray Hey! Jump in for as long as you can. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:09 pm RoxanneRhoads: #UFchat I hate it when the heroine is so stuck on her imperfections, flaws, or weaknesses that she is always whining about them
10:09 pm editorialdept: (ahem – immoRtality) #ufchat
10:09 pm readinasitting: RT @UF_Chat: Urban fantasy has lots of variety & draws a lot of diff. types. Let?s start positive. Q: what do you really LOVE? #UFchat
10:09 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @editorialdept Vangst #UFchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: RT @editorialdept: Peeve – brooding, sullen, but oh-so-irresistable characters. We get it – immotality/shapeshifting’s a drag. YAWN. #ufchat
10:10 pm LadyinGray: @amandabonilla Hey there, uber awesome crit partner #ufchat
10:10 pm leapetra: Fav UF story, written by Tee Morris. “Billibub Baddings and the Case of the Singing Sword” Dwarf PI in Chicago. two strong women! #ufchat
10:10 pm marirandomities: @leapetra The head is not important, don’t you see? lol #ufchat
10:10 pm amandabonilla: @VampBookClub Though I try to include other strong female characters, I think a lot of UF shows a girl who can “hang with the boys” #ufchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: Once again: We?ll look at 2 aspects: 1) the image/the look of UF and 2) the writing/ the stories/ the content. Ready? Questions next #UFchat
10:10 pm editorialdept: I see a lot of ass-kicking heroines, but not often a focus on brains over brawn. Would love to see more MacGyver types vs. Rambos. #ufchat
10:11 pm marirandomities: RT @UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley love mythology, folklore & the gritty old world fairy tales UF = contemp equivalent #ufchat
10:11 pm LadyinGray: @HC_Palmquist BBQ–and hubby’s the chef tonight πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:11 pm miranda00writes: HOLY CRAP, so many tweets I can’t keep up #UFChat
10:11 pm SpiceBites: The villains are more interesting. Thinking of Ilona Andrews here. #UFchat
10:11 pm HC_Palmquist: @editorialdept OOH!!! That would be AWESOME! Love MacGyver. #UFchat
10:11 pm editorialdept: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: @editorialdept Vangst <<ha! Yes! That sums it up perfectly. #ufchat
10:11 pm jimnduncan: Personally, I love writing the flawed characters who aren’t initally strong enough to handle the paranormal elements. #ufchat
10:11 pm marirandomities: RT @editorialdept: Peeve – brooding, sullen, but oh-so-irresistable characters. We get it – immotality/shapeshiftings a drag. YAWN. #ufchat
10:11 pm UF_Chat: Starting positive again (sometimes harder to think on good) Q1: UF covers: The blurbs, the tag lines & the images: what?s to love? #UFchat
10:11 pm HC_Palmquist: @miranda00writes Hop into http://tweetchat.com/room/UFchat. Much easier to follow along. #UFchat
10:12 pm LadyinGray: @amandabonilla @vampbookclub I’m cool w/ a girl being in a “boys” club, but I get irritated when all the boys fall for the 1 girl #ufchat
10:12 pm Jinxie_G: I’m late for #UFchat. Be on when I catch my breath.
10:12 pm editorialdept: Cover art & blurbs: I love the touch of noir. It promises a great story within. #ufchat
10:12 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan Nice! Looking forward to reading some of that. Tired of completely capable people who just whine. #UFchat
10:13 pm HoodedMan: What is generally lacking? Realism #UFchat
10:13 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat With Billibub Baddings and the Case of the Singing Sword The noir aspects of the story were the best. #ufchat
10:13 pm Cameron_Haley: Re: covers…UF sells well enough that publishers are getting fantastic artists doing really excellent work. Even headless women. #UFchat
10:13 pm RoxanneRhoads: #UFchat I love strong heroines that accept their weaknesses & flaws- moving past them to become a kick ass save the world woman
10:13 pm amandabonilla: @LadyinGray Agreed. I think a lot of us who write UF were/are probably more social with men than women. We’re just grown-up tomboys #ufchat
10:13 pm leapetra: RT @jimnduncan: Personally, I love writing the flawed characters who arent initally strong enough to handle the paranormal elements. #ufchat
10:13 pm VampBookClub: @amandabonilla I get that and relate to it, but often other female characters are simple. #ufchat
10:13 pm UF_Chat: Does anyone like ANYTHING about the covers? #UFchat
10:14 pm entre_libros: RT @UF_Chat: TODAY?S TOPIC: UF – The Good, the Bad & the Untapped: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves & Wish Lists #UFchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley That’s a good point. #UFchat
10:14 pm RoxanneRhoads: #UFchat I also love new twists on old stories & myths, great world building, & I am always ready for something new & out of the ordinary
10:14 pm brimfire: @Cameron_Haley Ha! I love headless women covers. They let me make up on my own what the heroine looks like. #ufchat #UFchat
10:14 pm VampBookClub: @amandabonilla Maybe it is more that a second stronger woman is automatically a challenge is my issue. #ufchat
10:14 pm leapetra: Are their any heroines that have to face the monsters and get their kids to school, if not, I might have another novel idea #ufchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: S: Fall 2010 fantasy cover trends by The Enchanted Inkpot http://bit.ly/becvuS (With nice visual summary) #UFchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: S: Recently making rounds: The Chart of Fantasy Art: changing fashion trends of UF heroines (by Orbit books) http://bit.ly/bN4wq3 #UFchat
10:15 pm UF_Chat: S: The Chart of Fantasy Art Pt 4: UF Title Trends & Fonts (by Orbit books) http://bit.ly/aqjoof #UFchat
10:15 pm amandabonilla: @VampBookClub Agreed! I think that’s something we as writers can address and remedy! #ufchat
10:15 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat There are some creative covers, but like with vampires, the companies are throwing copycat covers out there #ufchat
10:15 pm marirandomities: I like artistic covers with illustrations, not photos. I think it’s rare on the US though. #ufchat
10:15 pm HoodedMan: @marirandomities Immortality would be great, in most cases, of course. Most paranormal people in any fiction are way too mundane #UFchat
10:15 pm editorialdept: @leapetra wasn’t there that demon killing soccer mom series? Haven’t read it, but have seen the covers… #ufchat
10:15 pm shadowflame1974: RT @UF_Chat: S: The Chart of Fantasy Art Pt 4: UF Title Trends & Fonts (by Orbit books) http://bit.ly/aqjoof #UFchat
10:15 pm brimfire: @UF_Chat Honestly, I ❀ most UF covers. I like solo woman on cover with weapons/magic like Kim Harrison, Patricia Briggs etc #UFchat
10:15 pm UF_Chat: Q1a: UF covers: The blurbs, the tag lines & the images: what?s to hate/the ugly? (Now you can go to town on the peeves!) #UFchat
10:15 pm VampBookClub: RT @RoxanneRhoads: #UFchat I love strong heroines that accept their weaknesses & flaws- moving past them to become a kick ass save the world woman
10:16 pm leapetra: @editorialdept cool I will have to find that one #ufchat
10:16 pm amandabonilla: I’m liking that heroines on UF covers are less scantilly clad and wearing battle-ready ensembles! #ufchat
10:16 pm Cameron_Haley: I actually think the “back of woman with tattoo” phase is over. Look at the covers (inc. mine!) out this summer/fall. #UFchat
10:16 pm HoodedMan: @marirandomities Describing immortals and witches and bunch longing for “a normal life” is ridiculous, in my eyes #UFchat
10:16 pm UF_Chat: @marirandomities Also find photos intrusive. Impression stays, Very hard to get beyond & form own impressions even if good writing. #UFchat
10:16 pm brimfire: @editorialdept I think the demon killer soccer mom series by Julie Kenner. I read/enjoyed different series of hers. #UFchat
10:17 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Agree – tats are on the way out – it’s abs now apparently. sigh. #UFchat
10:17 pm marirandomities: Nice! RT @UF_Chat: S: Fall 2010 fantasy cover trends by The Enchanted Inkpot http://bit.ly/becvuS (With nice visual summary) #ufchat
10:17 pm leapetra: What is it with all the great looking demons, vampires, werewolves, etc. Could we have one nerdy one? πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:17 pm LadyinGray: From a YA POV, I like the covers of Lili St. Crow’s STRANGE ANGELS (esp. the first book). Heroine looking ready to kick butt #ufchat
10:17 pm amandabonilla: RT @HoodedMan: @marirandomities Describing immortals and witches and bunch longing for “a normal life” is ridiculous, in my eyes #UFchat
10:17 pm shadowflame1974: @HoodedMan #ufchat why would it be ridiculous when we want to have powers like they do #UFchat
10:17 pm thedragongem: SInce I read a lot of ebooks I hardly pay attention to the covers anymore but it has made me read books I wouldn’t have read #UFchat
10:18 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Your 1st cover refreshingly different. Was surprised by 2nd tho – didn’t quite look like same series. Tho nice still. #UFchat
10:18 pm LiaKeyes: RT @UF_Chat: S: Fall 2010 fantasy cover trends by The Enchanted Inkpot http://bit.ly/becvuS (With nice visual summary) #UFchat
10:18 pm SpiceBites: Like covers focusing on the elements, esp. water or fire. #UFchat #UFchat
10:18 pm RoxanneRhoads: @UF_Chat #UFchat I love book covers, especially ones that really stand out but that are not misleading, Nightshade is a great cover
10:18 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat LOL. No abs in MOB RULES, Stewart’s A DEVIL IN THE DETAILS, Stacia’s Downside, etc. #UFchat
10:18 pm marirandomities: @UF_Chat There’s also the bad quality assembling. blegh #ufchat
10:18 pm editorialdept: @leapetra oh, yes please! It’s time for some nerdy UF heroes/heroines. #ufchat
10:18 pm amandabonilla: @UF_Chat And why so much flesh on these covers? My heroine would find the lack of clothing completely impractical #ufchat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: Anybody commenting on the blurbs/back cover summaries? (I know it’s hard to get past the visuals) #UFchat
10:19 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Model change from book one to book two, same artist (Tim Bradstreet). #UFchat
10:19 pm RoxanneRhoads: #UFchat I absolutely love Jeaniene Frost’s Night huntress series covers- orginal art made just for the books & they fit the stories
10:19 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept He he – nerdy UF heros/heroines #UFchat
10:19 pm marirandomities: @HoodedMan I’m not so sure about the immortals. Or maybe they all would long for death? The witches would long for immortality, heh. #ufchat
10:20 pm amandabonilla: Patricia Briggs cover art is brilliant! I know… tattoos. But they tell a story so it totally fits #ufchat
10:20 pm UF_Chat: Personally I do NOT like it when blurb weights romance factor too much (or too little). ie. doesn’t reflect focus of book. Annoying. #UFchat
10:20 pm LadyinGray: @amandabonilla Exposed skin = chink in armor IMHO. Don’t know too many heroines who’d actually fight in that bustier. #ufchat
10:20 pm Cameron_Haley: Re: nerdy heroes. Read A DEVIL IN THE DETAILS! Somewhat geeky modern-day samurai who fights demons. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:20 pm brimfire: @UF_Chat Linnea Sinclair’s Rebels&Lovers had a nerdy hero. It’s sci-fi romance, but basically UF in space. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:20 pm amandabonilla: @RoxanneRhoads I love Frost’s covers as well! #ufchat
10:20 pm SpiceBites: @UF Chat since many of the cover run together, i pick books based on back cover blurbs & quick read of 1st page#UFchat #UFchat
10:21 pm jimnduncan: @amandabonilla lol agree. My heroine wears jeans, hiking boots and a bomber jacket, not half-naked with tattoos. #ufchat
10:21 pm amandabonilla: @LadyinGray EXACTLY! Steel-toed boots and plenty of skin covering, please! #ufchat
10:21 pm brimfire: I agree the cover clothing is impractical but if bk doesn’t have that look now, I tend to think it’s not the type of book I’ll like. #UFchat
10:21 pm inkgypsy: RT @Cameron_Haley: Re: nerdy heroes. Read A DEVIL IN THE DETAILS! Somewhat geeky modern-day samurai who fights demons. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:22 pm marirandomities: @UF_Chat I find the blurbs mostly boring. Same formula over and over again. #ufchat
10:22 pm UF_Chat: Q1b: UF covers: cover vs content? How do you feel they reflect – accurate, not? Love? Hate? #UFchat
10:22 pm SpiceBites: @amandabonilla Totally agree on Patricia Briggs covers. Also Marjorie M Liu’s. As long as the art fits the story. #UFchat
10:23 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Personally I do NOT like it when blurb weights romance factor too much (or too little). ie. doesn’t reflect focus of book. Annoying. #UFchat
10:23 pm marirandomities: Agreed! RT @editorialdept: @leapetra oh, yes please! Its time for some nerdy UF heroes/heroines. #ufchat
10:23 pm brimfire: @marirandomities I don’t really care what blurbs say; the author blurbing them, though, can make me buy a book #UFchat
10:23 pm LadyinGray: All right. My guests are here. Time to check out. Hopefully, I can sign in for a future #ufchat
10:23 pm amandabonilla: Sometimes the cover art doesn’t do justice to the story. I always read at least the first chapter & never decide based on cover art #ufchat
10:23 pm UF_Chat: @marirandomities Agree many blurbs that way – it’s not the paranormal/half-whatever that’s interesting – it’s the person’s conflict. #UFchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: @LadyinGray Bye! Thanks for dropping in. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:24 pm amandabonilla: @LadyinGray Talk to you later! Have a fun evening! #ufchat
10:24 pm HoodedMan: I think it’s ridiculous that anyone would want what goes for normal life these days, though… #UFchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: @brimfire This is one of reasons I rely on reviews a lot. Rarely buy without review or author blogged on their book’s process now. #UFchat
10:25 pm leapetra: RT @HoodedMan: I think its ridiculous that anyone would want what goes for normal life these days, though… #ufchat
10:25 pm SpiceBites: @HoodedMan Define normal life #UFchat
10:25 pm amandabonilla: @HoodedMan Which is why we read/write UF. Normal just doesn’t cut it! #ufchat
10:25 pm HoodedMan: I write about special people that know the value of independence and freedom beyond words #UFchat
10:25 pm UF_Chat: FIXER QUESTION: Q1c: UF covers: what do you think is untapped? What would you like to see instead? #UFchat
10:26 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat More action, less runway posing. #UFchat
10:26 pm marirandomities: @brimfire @UF_Chat Problem is the language used in formulaic blurbs: When heroin goes to… X happens. I don’t like it. #ufchat
10:26 pm thedragongem: I’d like to see the villian. #UFchat
10:26 pm amandabonilla: @UF_Chat Fully clothed women in practical battle gear. Still looks sexy IMO. #ufchat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: Did I stump y’all? He he. I’d suggest people in action, less ‘posing’. #UFchat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Oo – I just tweeted similar. #UFchat
10:27 pm kjhatch: A1b: I haven’t found UF covers to be that accurate, but honestly I have the same complaint about other genres too. #UFChat
10:27 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Yes, we agree! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: @thedragongem Interesting – want to see the threat – might be tough since not always obvious… interesting challenge! #UFchat
10:28 pm amandabonilla: Also, I’d like to see more characters on a cover. Besides just the MC. Maybe an ensemble cover. #ufchat
10:28 pm SpiceBites: Fully clothed women can be sexy and display common sense. As a reader I can relate more. #UFchat
10:28 pm UF_Chat: Q2: Re image/marketing: (writing next) UF creatures featured: which ones are overexposed/ overused? What are you sick of and why? #UFchat
10:28 pm Cameron_Haley: *picks up book to look at page 90* #UFchat
10:28 pm thedragongem: You could always make it shady or in shadows. Make it interesting trying to figure out who it is. #UFchat
10:28 pm leapetra: How about a woman in full gear, running through a supermarket! #ufchat
10:29 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley He – I’m a big user of the ‘look inside’ feature when buying online too. #UFchat
10:29 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat Vampires (And I write about them, sigh) #ufchat
10:29 pm marirandomities: @leapetra Why is 90 the magic number? #ufchat
10:29 pm jimnduncan: @UF_Chat I’ve not read enough to be sick of any yet. #ufchat
10:29 pm SpiceBites: I’m going to have to try the Pg 90 test! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:29 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra I have images of toppling orange stacks… LOL #UFchat
10:29 pm editorialdept: Another thought on bookcovers – does anything ever happen in daylight? Seems they’re always twilight/night/fog #ufchat
10:29 pm kjhatch: A1c: Animated covers. I’ve noticed with ebooks I have started to ignore covers in general. Animation would make covers cool again. #UFChat
10:30 pm marirandomities: Absolutely. πŸ™‚ RT @UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley He – Im a big user of the look inside feature when buying online too. #ufchat
10:30 pm leapetra: @marirandomities it was suggest to me along time ago, that or page 200. #ufchat
10:30 pm thedragongem: I want to see more UF heroes with animal sidekicks/familiars. #UFchat
10:30 pm SpiceBites: Show more of the world. #UFchat
10:30 pm UF_Chat: Still on image/marketing – focusing on creatures. What are you tired of – and more importantly: why in particular? #UFchat
10:30 pm SkullJuggler: RT @editorialdept: Peeve – brooding, sullen, but oh-so-irresistable characters. We get it – immotality/shapeshifting’s a drag. YAWN. #ufchat
10:30 pm HoodedMan: @leapetra that IS good advice. 2 me it’s usually sufficient with the 1. paragraph test, though, & then I may move on 2 page 90 #UFchat
10:30 pm SkullJuggler: RT @editorialdept: I see a lot of ass-kicking heroines, but not often a focus on brains over brawn. Would love to see more MacGyver types vs. Rambos. #ufchat
10:31 pm Cameron_Haley: @editorialdept Hello! Look at avatar to the left…daylight! #UFchat
10:31 pm marirandomities: Haha, great imagery! RT @leapetra: How about a woman in full gear, running through a supermarket! #ufchat
10:31 pm melk_va: Completely agree with you *nods* RT @RoxanneRhoads #UFchat I love strong heroines that accept their weaknesses & (cont) http://tl.gd/3cksej
10:31 pm SkullJuggler: RT @editorialdept: Here’s a slightly less common peeve – monsters/characters on the cover that do not resemble those in the book at all! #ufchat
10:31 pm leapetra: covers: Get out of the cemeteries! #ufchat
10:31 pm marirandomities: @leapetra I’ll have to try that. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:31 pm amandabonilla: @editorialdept I think it’s because most of the action in UF happens at night. We just love the dark πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:31 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch I’ve noticed ‘chick lit UF’ (is there such a sub-genre?) is using cartoony covers a lot now – hot trend since the Hot Mama. #UFchat
10:31 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I’d like something stark like the good modern penguin covers. #ufchat
10:32 pm SkullJuggler: RT @editorialdept: Another thought on bookcovers – does anything ever happen in daylight? Seems they’re always twilight/night/fog #ufchat
10:32 pm editorialdept: @amandabonilla I think we’re all night owl authors πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:32 pm jimnduncan: @SkullJuggler OH! MacGuyver type heroine would be awesome. #ufchat
10:32 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley I particularly like yours has daylight – how can you have a UF in LA without sun? Seriously. Good call by your team. #UFchat
10:33 pm kjhatch: A2: I’m tired of seeing anthropomorphic half-human creatures that basically are people except in some small visual way. #UFChat
10:33 pm editorialdept: RT @jimnduncan: @SkullJuggler OH! MacGuyver type heroine would be awesome. <<already sketching out a plot πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:33 pm HoodedMan: Covers should say something specific about the story, but most suffer from what I call the scantly clad female on the hood syndrome #UFchat
10:33 pm UF_Chat: @amandabonilla We do love dark (total night creature here) but cannot avoid sun altogether. See @Cameron_Haley‘s bk: sun yet ‘dark’! #UFchat
10:34 pm SpiceBites: To me the soccer mom series was chick lit in the next stage UF. JMO. #UFchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan Shh! Workin’ on it. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: Q2a: Vampires. (You knew it was coming) Lots say ?enough already? ? why do you REALLY think many are sick of them? #UFchat
10:34 pm kjhatch: It’s basically no better than “forehead ridges” to make an alien. Maybe great for cosplayers, but bad for character. #UFChat
10:35 pm HoodedMan: That (female on the hood syndrome) doesn’t make me buy a buy a book, or even show interest, but turns me off, really #UFchat
10:35 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Solve the daylight scarcity in UF and you’ll solve the abundance of vampires, too. Unless they’re sparkly vampires. #UFchat
10:35 pm marirandomities: RT @HoodedMan: Covers shd say something about story, but most suffer from what I call the scantly clad female on the hood syndrome #ufchat
10:35 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch Good observation. (forehead ridges = shorthand for alien equivalent) #UFchat
10:36 pm jimnduncan: Curious why we can’t have covers that depict a particularly telling scene from the story. #ufchat
10:36 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat I’m sure ‘chick lit UF’ is easy to categorize πŸ˜‰ Covers change with trends too easily, like all the Twilight-styles ones #UFchat
10:36 pm editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
10:37 pm SpiceBites: LOL! It must be hard for writers of vampire stories in the aftermath of Twilight and sparkly vamps. Loved her werewolves tho. #UFchat
10:37 pm leapetra: @editorialdept leave that for TV #ufchat
10:37 pm thedragongem: Yes bring on the scary vamps. #UFchat
10:37 pm UF_Chat: Personally tired of emo-monsters. The big bad can now (often) be reasoned with/cajoled etc. Not true threat. #UFchat
10:37 pm amandabonilla: Have to bow out a little early today. Thanks for a great chat. Hope to see you all next week! #ufchat
10:37 pm leapetra: @SpiceBites It is, but when you connect to the people that want something different, they are gratful #ufchat
10:38 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @jimnduncan Does your book suit a stark cover? #ufchat
10:38 pm UF_Chat: @amandabonilla Bye! Sorry you’ll miss the meat. It’s gonna be chunky. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:38 pm HoodedMan: Many are sick of vampires in recent books/films because those from those books/films aren’t truly described as vampires #UFchat
10:38 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat How about they listen to your reasons and still rip you apart? πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:38 pm amandabonilla: @UF_Chat HA! No doubt! I’ll definitely catch the transcript. Thanks for hosting! #ufchat
10:39 pm UF_Chat: I’m on the ‘bring back the monsters’ team too. #UFchat
10:39 pm HoodedMan: Vampires are very interesting to both authors and readers, IF they are described as vampires… #UFchat
10:39 pm bonn1511: #ufchat I made it. What did I miss?
10:39 pm editorialdept: Here’s a related question – think of your favorite UF books. Do they break new ground or use cliches? Cliches aren’t always bad. #ufchat
10:39 pm UF_Chat: @HoodedMan Yes – they’ve essentially taken away their teeth (& therefore their mythological resonance). 😦 #UFchat
10:40 pm UF_Chat: Q2b: Werewolves. (The 2nd most commonly used ?monster?) same Q ? why are people REALLY sick of them? #UFchat
10:40 pm kjhatch: @jimnduncan Don’t know if this still holds true, but read years ago that many cover artists never read the story, work from summary #ufchat
10:40 pm Cameron_Haley: @editorialdept Fine line between cliches and genre tropes and conventions. Trick is to use them in a fresh way, I think. #UFchat
10:41 pm thedragongem: Love True Blood but afraid to read the books in case the tv series disappoints. #UFchat
10:41 pm HoodedMan: That leaves out children books. A vampire story that isn’t gory or/and raunchy just isn’t a vampire story #UFchat
10:41 pm shadowflame1974: They are sick of them because no one takes a different approach to them. #UFchat. #UFchat
10:41 pm SpiceBites: My fav. cliche/idea: magic has a cost to the user. #UFchat
10:41 pm UF_Chat: @marirandomities Pleasantly surprised. The vamps/others are still pretty scary – (haven’t seen this season tho. sigh. Miss HBO) #UFchat
10:41 pm bonn1511: @marirandomities I prefer the books myself. #ufchat
10:41 pm jimnduncan: @Ben_Aaronovitch I like to think so. It leans more in the noir/thriller direction than paranormal. #ufchat
10:41 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat Scifi gets a lot of flak for having unrealistic aliens, but I don’t see why the same standards don’t hold for fantasy too. #UFchat
10:41 pm Cameron_Haley: I think the number of genre readers who *aren’t* sick of vampires and werewolves vastly outnumbers those who are. #UFchat
10:42 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch I read that too – rarely get to read more than someone else’s summary – not even author’s summary much of the time. #UFchat
10:42 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat My fav, werewolf Sgt Angula from Discworld, strong female, vegetarian when human. #ufchat
10:42 pm marirandomities: @thedragongem I’m most curious about the books! Wouldn’t care for them if not for the TV series. Am afraid to like TV thing better.. #ufchat
10:42 pm thedragongem: I like werewolves and shifters…haven’t tired of them yet. #UFchat
10:42 pm marirandomities: Agreed. RT @HoodedMan: That leaves out children books. A vampire story that isnt gory or/and raunchy just isnt a vampire story #ufchat
10:42 pm jimnduncan: @kjhatch that wouldn’t surprise me at all. #ufchat
10:43 pm HoodedMan: RT @leapetra Werewolves are becoming the big pets, insulting to werewolves really. #ufchat // Oh, horror
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra Agree – more doglike with bad tempers than wolfman monsters (of course actual wolves are pretty civilized in reality!) #UFchat
10:43 pm marirandomities: @UF_Chat Same here. I love the TV series! Did you read the books? #ufchat
10:43 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @jimnduncan Don’t tell anyone but I wanted a half naked woman with her back to the camera. #ufchat
10:43 pm editorialdept: @Cameron_Haley Agreed. Genre readers still love good stories. It’s the dabblers in genre that complain about x or y being overdone. #ufchat
10:43 pm SpiceBites: Woot! Another vote for Sgt Angula from Disc World, also love Patricia Briggs Omega & Alpha series. #UFchat
10:43 pm marirandomities: Why is that? RT @bonn1511: @marirandomities I prefer the books myself. #ufchat
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @marirandomities You might – they’re very different. I liked the 1st one tho in particular. #UFchat
10:43 pm kjhatch: The shiny vampires and friendly werewolves are the same problem. They’re made too human, weakens the contrast with humanity. #UFchat
10:44 pm UF_Chat: Q2c: Re the writing: What are your favorite ?takes? on/ uses of unusual creatures in UF? Examples? #UFchat
10:44 pm HoodedMan: Civilized vampires or werewolves… an oxymoron for sure #ufchat
10:44 pm UF_Chat: RT @kjhatch: The shiny vampires and friendly werewolves are the same problem. They’re made too human, weakens the contrast with humanity. #UFchat
10:44 pm marirandomities: @UF_Chat Hmm, good to know. Thanks for the tip. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:45 pm editorialdept: RT @UF_Chat: Q2c: favorite ?takes? on/ uses of unusual creatures in UF? Examples? <<Jane Lindskold’s Changer & Legends Walking #ufchat
10:45 pm SpiceBites: Also love the feys of the Merry Gentry world. Um, esp. some of the guys. #UFchat
10:45 pm marirandomities: @leapetra I have some nice trolls myself. But they’re an exception in their own world too. Psst, my readers don’t know that yet! #ufchat
10:45 pm thedragongem: I like that Jim Butcher’s vampires all have different type’s of powers and strengths. #UFchat
10:45 pm Holomos: RT @HoodedMan: RT @leapetra Werewolves are becoming the big pets, insulting to werewolves really. #ufchat // Oh, horror
10:45 pm leapetra: @HoodedMan you can have a civilized vampire, he just will make sure he kills you in the bathroom, clean up is easier #ufchat
10:45 pm editorialdept: Changer didn’t have vamps or werewolves – just “classic” mythological critters and urban legends – sasquatch, satyrs, King Arthur… #ufchat
10:46 pm kjhatch: I have already seen a new trend starting with books featuring “real vampires,” so hopefully we’ll see more bumps in the night soon. #ufchat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: One recent fave – the banshee in Kim Harrisson’s Rachel Morgan series. That was a true monster but with layers. #UFchat
10:46 pm marirandomities: RT @HoodedMan: RT @leapetra Werewolves are becoming the big pets, insulting to werewolves really. #ufchat // Oh, horror #ufchat
10:46 pm TrueBloodBot: RT @marirandomities Talking about TV, what’s your opinion about True Blood? #ufchat
10:46 pm SpiceBites: RT @leapetra:@HoodedMan you can have a civilized vampire, he just will make sure he kills you in the bathroom, clean up is easierLOL #UFchat
10:47 pm leapetra: @marirandomities I have a troll in mine to, He’s a “southern” troll more human, but still a troll #ufchat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: This chat is flying & I’m not even 1/2 way through the questions… #UFchat
10:47 pm jimnduncan: @UF_Chat Ah. I’ve not read that far in that series. Banshee sounds cool. #ufchat
10:47 pm HoodedMan: @kjhatch both those syndromes are bad #UFchat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: Q4: The kick-ass girls/women: what?s to love? What?s the ugly? What needs a revisit? What would you like to see? #UFchat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: (yep – I missed a question there – if you’re curious ask me later πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:47 pm kjhatch: @marirandomities I tried watching True Blood, but couldn’t stand it. My mother’s a geek and loves the show, so perhaps it’s just me #ufchat
10:48 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat I would like to see them stop falling in love with the monster. #ufchat
10:48 pm editorialdept: Heroines – the ugly? The “perfect” ones. Ones w/ superhuman gifts – strength, agility, etc. Want to see them struggle a bit. #ufchat
10:48 pm DEcharacters: made it in time for the end of the chat. *peeks in* #UFchat
10:49 pm suzannembest: RT @kjhatch: The shiny vampires and friendly werewolves are the same problem. They’re made too human, weakens the contrast with humanity. #UFchat
10:49 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan I get very tired of the humans-with-superpowers aspects – great to see an actual monster with own world view. #UFchat
10:49 pm HoodedMan: @SpiceBites 9 to 5 work, 2.4 children, briefly speaking, with variations #UFchat
10:49 pm Cameron_Haley: My only real pet peeve about UF heroines is they sometimes mistake “aggression” and “toughness.” #UFchat
10:49 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Must sleep will catch up on transcript <yawn> night. #ufchat
10:49 pm marirandomities: @kjhatch A matter of personal preferences. No problem there. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:50 pm marirandomities: Good one. RT @leapetra: @UF_Chat I would like to see them stop falling in love with the monster. #ufchat
10:50 pm leapetra: I would like to see more anime and magna influence coming in. Thinking Hellsing in particular #ufchat
10:50 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch Where did you come in? I thought 2nd season was a little heavy on the Maenad (sp?) & associated stuff. #UFchat
10:50 pm ladytechie: I like a lot of cool powers, but would like to see new powers popping up out of no where over and over #UFChat
10:50 pm UF_Chat: Q4a: The kick-ass bad-boys & the alpha males: Love? Hate? What would make them fresh? #UFchat
10:51 pm ladytechie: I mean for them not to keep popping up over and over book after book #UFChat
10:51 pm SpiceBites: Want more to the char. than just beat up bad guy, angst, get it on with the hot guy. #UFchat
10:52 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat If there’s “bad boys” and “alpha males” so described in the story, it probably isn’t for me… #UFchat
10:52 pm Betwixt_: RT @marirandomities: I don’t think people will tire of vampires so soon, despite of all the “enough already” being said. #ufchat
10:53 pm thedragongem: I’d like to see more Dresden like characters #UFchat
10:53 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley I’d like to see the humans have equal go at the girl’s heart. Brute strength/super-powers doesn’t = better. #UFchat
10:53 pm jimnduncan: @UF_Chat to honest, I don’t really like writing the alpha male type. #ufchat
10:54 pm leapetra: RT @thedragongem: Id like to see more Dresden like characters #ufchat
10:54 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat Season one, early on. Mon was hooked on the thing immediately, and we always cross-recommend shows to check out. #ufchat
10:54 pm brimfire: Yes. This. RT @SpiceBites: Want more to the char. than just beat up bad guy, angst, get it on with the hot guy. #UFchat
10:54 pm UF_Chat: @thedragongem Private eye paying the rent? Or wizards? #UFchat
10:54 pm SpiceBites: Wary of Alpha males b/c they often seem to be prettied up bullies and/or idiots on the page #UFchat
10:54 pm HoodedMan: @leapetra @SpiceBites I subsribe that to his/her experience, and sense of self-preservation, not civilized life #ufchat
10:54 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan I bring it up as many readers (esp Ro-crossover) say they ‘need’ an alpha male. Think not so straight fwd. #UFchat
10:55 pm thedragongem: Average Joe not really hot…gets himself into some stuff and has to figure out how to get out. #UFchat
10:55 pm UF_Chat: Q5: Weapons, MC strength & violence: 1st the weapons ? what?s overused, what?s hot, what do you love, what do you not? (he) #UFchat
10:55 pm Cameron_Haley: Tony Soprano is an “alpha male” as far as I’m concerned. Probably not every woman’s dream (could be wrong…). #UFchat
10:55 pm HoodedMan: RT @SpiceBites Want more to the char. than just beat up bad guy, angst, get it on with the hot guy. #UFchat // much more
10:55 pm marirandomities: Q5: I like the overused magical swords. Can’t help it. #ufchat
10:56 pm leapetra: Guns over rated, But I will always like a good sword. #ufchat
10:56 pm UF_Chat: We only have 5 minutes left on clock but I have a ton more Q’s- would you like to go on a little longer or have a Round 2 next week? #UFchat
10:56 pm editorialdept: weapons – i’m a sucker for a sword, magical or otherwise. Haven’t gotten tired of that yet. Guns, yawn. #ufchat
10:56 pm SpiceBites: Woot! Another vote for Average Joe/Jane! Or someone who yearns to be average. #UFchat
10:56 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat It was Underworld that ruin guns in UF for me. They are vampires and they need guns? #ufchat
10:56 pm marirandomities: @UF_Chat Round 2 next week? It’s late here…. 😦 #ufchat
10:57 pm cmdrsue: RT @leapetra: Guns over rated, But I will always like a good sword. #ufchat
10:57 pm brimfire: @UF_Chat I love alpha heroes but a well-created beta hero can win me over. I ❀ Nick in KimHarrison’s first bks. He was interesting. #UFchat
10:57 pm kjhatch: Anyone watch the show Dexter? It has more vampire-like character (without fantasy) than a lot of books/film/tv these days. #ufchat
10:57 pm leapetra: @marirandomities magical swords, get tiresome, I agree. But a good swordman is wonderful #ufchat
10:57 pm SpiceBites: My first UFchat was fun. Thanx! #UFchat
10:58 pm srolutola: RT @amandabonilla: Also, I’d like to see more characters on a cover. Besides just the MC. Maybe an ensemble cover. #ufchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Not every alpha ‘is’ tho – many ‘strong’ males just like control & not good at sharing. Not good ‘post-feminists’ πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:58 pm Cameron_Haley: @kjhatch Now we’re going to pick up DexterBot. LOL. #UFchat
10:58 pm marirandomities: @kjhatch Dexter is creepy. The show’s appeal worries me, but it’s good indeed. #ufchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch Ooh agree! I love that show (and worry about myself as a result.) #UFchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: RT @kjhatch: Anyone watch the show Dexter? It has more vampire-like character (without fantasy) than a lot of books/film/tv these days. #ufchat
10:58 pm jimnduncan: @UF_Chat like characters who aren’t all that kick-ass, who have to struggle and figure out how the hell to deal with para baddies. #ufchat
10:59 pm marirandomities: @leapetra Agree on swordsman, but magic + sword is cool anyway, heh. Except when sword does the work. Then blegh. #ufchat
11:00 pm leapetra: weapons. Best one! the Flashlight in Night Watch #ufchat
11:00 pm marirandomities: I’ve got the True Blood bot already, heh. RT @Cameron_Haley: @kjhatch Now were going to pick up DexterBot. LOL. #ufchat
11:00 pm Cameron_Haley: Forgive me for a quick plug. MOB RULES releases Wednesday. Available now at Amazon, B&N, others. http://amzn.to/cgAtPz Thanks! #UFchat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan Are many ways to have strength beyond muscles – which is good otherwise many more girls would have a rough time of it. #UFchat
11:00 pm kjhatch: A4a: The tough-but-dangerous cliche has been around longer than shiny vamps; it’s just an old, flat character problem. #ufchat
11:00 pm marirandomities: Yes! RT @jimnduncan: like characters who arent kick-ass, who have to struggle and figure out how the hell to deal with baddies. #ufchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: We’re out of time here – shall we have round 2 next week? I have a LOT more questions & we’re just starting to get to the gristle… #UFchat
11:01 pm jimnduncan: @UF_Chat sounds good to me. #ufchat
11:01 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Yeah, go round two next week. Good chat! #UFchat
11:01 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat either way now or next week. #ufchat
11:02 pm inkgypsy: RT @Cameron_Haley: Forgive me for a quick plug. MOB RULES releases Wednesday. Available now at Amazon, B&N, others. http://amzn.to/cgAtPz Thanks! #UFchat
11:02 pm kjhatch: I don’t mind the alpha males, as long as they are real, rounded, complex characters, like normal people. #ufchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: Pick up @Cameron_Haley‘s book! MOB RULES released this week! (Congrats Cameron) Los Angeles, mob underworld, magic juice, you want! #UFchat
11:03 pm bonn1511: #ufchat Sounds good. Thanks
11:03 pm editorialdept: one more quick peeve before we wrap: main characters running away from their destiny/inheritance/family role, etc. #ufchat
11:03 pm kjhatch: @bonn1511 Dexter’s on Showtime. Season 5 starts this fall. First 2 seasons are also available on Netflix streaming right now. #ufchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: ANNOUNCEMENT: We will have Round 2 of Pet Peeves & more next Saturday! Same bat time, same bat channel. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:04 pm leapetra: @editorialdept Works for RPG’s but in a book, can we stop. #ufchat
11:04 pm SpiceBites: Looking forward to it! #UFchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: That?s a wrap for #UFchat today! If you?re writing UF you may want to bookmark the transcript & come back next week for Round 2. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept We’re going to talk more about that one next week too. Violence, loners, pasts and more. #UFchat
11:06 pm kjhatch: A5: I do like swords, any kind. Overused or not, I’m happy seeing them. Really thinking about it, I don’t hate any weapons. #ufchat
11:06 pm HoodedMan: @leapetra For further info read my upcoming novel “Night on Earth”… πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:06 pm DEcharacters: will have to set time aside next week. Though, last time I got a novel idea. Getting plenty out of watching this great chat #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: Some additional resources on UF pet peeves & wish lists, for writers & readers in next few tweets (few added within chat today): #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: All Things Urban Fantasy: Top Ten List: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves ? 1. Sex breaks, not sex scenes http://bit.ly/bYmafd #UFchat
11:07 pm marirandomities: I meant “this *way* ” uh #ufchat
11:07 pm marirandomities: RT @UF_Chat: ANNOUNCEMENT: We will have Round 2 of Pet Peeves & more next Saturday! Same bat time, same bat channel. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:07 pm wulfshado: #UFchat Crap. Hubby worked late again and just finished supper. I missed it again.
11:07 pm UF_Chat: My Top Ten Urban Fantasy Pet Pevees ? @Abigail_ATUF Guest Blogger at Literary Escapism http://bit.ly/bWvbAz #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: Carrie Vaughan?s Analysis of Urban Fantasy: Pt II: When Things Go Wrong http://bit.ly/aKOvKb #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: On Urban Fantasy (why often shallow) from 2004 but still interesting by Arin i Asolde (LJ) http://bit.ly/aZG0Fz #UFchat
11:08 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat @marirandomities Dexter does a good job not glorifying the murder and remaining focused on the characters, no need to worry #ufchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: UF cover history 2007/8: Butt covers by Juno books http://bit.ly/b2RrFb & Urban Fantasy Land?s Cover Trends http://bit.ly/9HONrV #UFchat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: Reminder: UF writers announcement: Sheep & Wolves contest http://bit.ly/bx23QL Write traditional monster from new perspective. #UFchat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: We are slowly making a list of UF authors on Twitter on #UFchat blog site. Please suggest more to @inkgypsy or @snowppl #UFchat
11:09 pm marirandomities: @kjhatch That’s the glorifying thing that worries me. #ufchat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: Got a topic you want to chat about? Let me know! I?ll add it to the list & maybe even bump up the chat-date for it. ? #UFchat
11:10 pm marirandomities: RT @UF_Chat: Reminder: UF writers: Sheep & Wolves #contest http://bit.ly/bx23QL Write traditional monster from new perspective. #ufchat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: If you wish to highlight a UF release by an author here on Twitter from last week ? let me know & I?ll promote it. Just @inkgypsy #UFchat
11:11 pm kjhatch: RT @UF_Chat: Got a topic you want to chat about? Let me know! I?ll add it to the list & maybe even bump up the chat-date for it. ? #UFchat
11:11 pm UF_Chat: @UF_Chat lights out. πŸ˜‰ Transcript available on the #UFchat blog in 36hrs-ish, allowing for late comments. Just use the hashtag. #UFchat
11:12 pm kjhatch: RT @UF_Chat: ANNOUNCEMENT: We will have Round 2 of Pet Peeves & more next Saturday! Same bat time, same bat channel. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:12 pm UF_Chat: @wulfshado We’ll be having Round 2 next week but welcome to read hashtag & comment to be added to transcript. Just getting meaty… #UFchat
11:13 pm UF_Chat: @DEcharacters So glad to hear that! To get people writing and keep them creating is one of the reasons I wanted to do this. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:14 pm UF_Chat: @brimfire Just saw the tweet about Nick – agree! Xlnt beta I liked a lot. #UFchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra Interesting on Underworld guns! 1 of reasons initially liked Zimmer Bradley’s world = no distance weapons. Changes dynamic #UFchat
11:18 pm inkgypsy: That was crazy busy! What a fun #UFchat and I have to go back and read it all still. Doing Round 2 next week – didn’t get 1/2way thru Q’s!
11:21 pm UF_Chat: @QQwill Definitely. Check the #UFchat blog in about 36 hours (I allow for late comments by those who can’t attend – often have few)
11:24 pm SkullJuggler: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:25 pm VampBookClub: I was pulled away from #UFchat for a bit. For those who like PNR, we’re having a discussion of CRIMSON MOON Tues @ 9 EST. http://ow.ly/2wfaU
11:25 pm QQwill: RT @VampBookClub: I was pulled away from #UFchat for a bit. For those who like PNR, we’re having a discussion of CRIMSON MOON Tues @ 9 EST. http://ow.ly/2wfaU
11:26 pm inkgypsy: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:26 pm rixshep: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:28 pm rixshep: Sorry to miss #ufchat today, but is wife’s birthday! Romantic dinner is order of the day!
11:28 pm inkgypsy: RT @VampBookClub: I was pulled away from #UFchat for a bit. For those who like PNR, we’re having a discussion of CRIMSON MOON Tues @ 9 EST. http://ow.ly/2wfaU
11:31 pm SkullJuggler: @editorialdept #ufchat old, true… Unless the character doesn’t realize he/she is running away. Trying to consciously escape destiny is old
11:33 pm DJTmetz: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:34 pm EnbukyokuAline: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:34 pm inkgypsy: @QQwill Here’s the #UFchat blog link http://bit.ly/aQvjjy (let me know if you have trouble with it? Thinking of changing to other ‘host’)
11:36 pm KatReverie: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
11:37 pm inkgypsy: RT @LocoLuna: RT @evernightpub Do you have a romance, erotic rom, or urban fantasy ready 2 submit? Check our submissions // #UFchat #writing
11:40 pm ericahayes: oh, I missed #UFchat ! Bugger πŸ™‚ too early for a Sunday morning!
11:44 pm inkgypsy: Forgot to add the #UFchat hashtag.. RT @MerrieDestefano: Why I Love Urban Fantasy http://nblo.gs/7iSv4
11:47 pm JulieeJohnsonn: RT @inkgypsy: RT @LocoLuna: RT @evernightpub Do you have a romance, erotic rom, or urban fantasy ready 2 submit? Check our submissions // #UFchat #writing
11:48 pm JulieeJohnsonn: RT @UF_Chat: Reminder: UF writers announcement: Sheep & Wolves contest http://bit.ly/bx23QL Write traditional monster from new perspective. #UFchat
11:51 pm miranda00writes: @HC_Palmquist thanks for the hint. I’ll try that next week #UFchat
11:58 pm inkgypsy: @tadbo I must have been busy modding #UFchat at the time – can you relink me?
August 29, 2010
12:20 am tasmin21: Napped right through #UFChat and I am sad. Thanks to @Cameron_Haley for mentioning me where appropriate. πŸ˜‰
1:15 am annikkawoods: Dang it. Slept through #ufchat. 😦 Oh well. Hope it was a good one!
1:17 am maantren: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
3:12 am rixshep: rt @editorialdept quick peeve … main character running away from destiny/inheritance. #ufchat / Started with Aragorn/Strider in #LOTR!
5:27 am Ben_Aaronovitch: I’ve got to start getting up later on Saturday so I can stay up for all over #UFchat It’s like I’m 8 years old I swear…
7:07 am AnassaRh: They may not be quite as delighted to hear that I’ll have a lot to say on the topic of #UFChat tonight, but I hope they are.
7:43 am AnassaRh: Read a UF recently where thick leather was only decent protection against demon claws, and barely. @shadowflame1974 @miranda00writes #UFChat
7:52 am AnassaRh: Likes? Mysteries. Humor. The what-ifs. How reality and myth/magic blend. How any blend is possible. #UFchat
7:55 am AnassaRh: My general peeves: When sex is thrown in just ’cause. Only 1 strong woman. Women we’re told are smart and strong, but aren’t. #UFchat
7:56 am AnassaRh: More peeves: Little variation in covers. Mandatory love interests for women. Weak mysteries I figure out too quickly. #UFchat
7:58 am AnassaRh: Peeves (sorry, keep thinking of them!): MCs who Must Do It Solo even when they have support networks with useful skills. #UFChat
8:01 am AnassaRh: Peeves: Series that a) fall apart or b) get crazy after Book 3ish. Characters with a Secret Destiny. #UFchat
8:01 am AnassaRh: RT @editorialdept: I see a lot of ass-kicking heroines, but not often a focus on brains over brawn. Would love to see more MacGyver types vs. Rambos. #ufchat
8:04 am AnassaRh: A1: Love how even w/in cliches, you can get a general sense of the book. Love when tag lines are snappy, funny. #ufchat
8:07 am AnassaRh: A1: Title allusions! Enjoy pinpointing the phrase (lit, music, movies). πŸ˜‰ Also what @Cameron_Haley said: cover artist WIN. #ufchat
8:10 am AnassaRh: @leapetra Re: mother heroines: Look up @kellyhgay‘s Better Part of Darkness. #ufchat
8:19 am AnassaRh: Q1a: I wish there were more variation?not just MC + city, but scenes, minor chars in foreground, less photo-real where appropriate. #ufchat
8:21 am AnassaRh: Q1a: I don’t like when tag lines try to hard for humor. Vague blurbs, or 1s that don’t match my experience (eg, “thrilling!”). #ufchat
8:23 am AnassaRh: Q1a: Have also lost some faith in authors who’ve blurbed books I didn’t like. Suspect that’s not quite on topic, though. #ufchat
8:24 am AnassaRh: This! RT @leapetra: What is it with all the great looking demons, vampires, werewolves, etc. Could we have one nerdy one? πŸ™‚ #ufchat
8:26 am AnassaRh: Q1a: Back covers? Hadn’t even thought? Dislike when minor element is played as major, or plot misrepresented. #ufchat
8:33 am AnassaRh: Q1b: Have found cover-content match about 50/50, for image, tag, summary. Really dislike misrepresentation of story in any of above. #ufchat
8:35 am AnassaRh: Q1b: If I’m buying w/o recommendation or review, I go by front cover, back cover, pull page, first pages, in that order. #ufchat
8:38 am AnassaRh: I suspect the fixer questions will be difficult to answer. Q1c’s giving me trouble? #ufchat
8:43 am AnassaRh: Q1c More people, and settings more obviously from the book. Epic fantasy has action, landscape, 1/2 the cast. Why not UF? #ufchat
8:47 am AnassaRh: Also, memory sketchy here, but wasn’t there a period where fantasy covers were a scene, lots of detail? 80s, early 90s? ? #ufchat
8:50 am AnassaRh: What about instead of Rachel Morgan with a gun in the city, we get Rachel Morgan brewing potions in the kitchen, weapons at hand? #ufchat
9:03 am AnassaRh: Q2 I’d like to see more talk about the books without vamps, weres, or demons. I hear UF, I think vamp, and that’s inaccurate. #ufchat
9:04 am AnassaRh: Perhaps that would help with the dismissiveness we encounter? “Oh, it’s just another vampire novel” “No, actually, no vamps at all”. #ufchat
9:06 am AnassaRh: That said, think vamps, weres, demons overused, in sense that I’d lk 2 C more bks w/o them. Still seeing ppl do new things, though. #ufchat
9:08 am AnassaRh: When the Big 3 are cookie-cutter, I don’t enjoy. Gimme a twist! Gimme an alien culture! They’re not human, so make me think so. #ufchat
9:08 am AnassaRh: And yes, I’m kind of talking about the writing too, but the writing question seems to have gotten skipped? #ufchat
9:09 am AnassaRh: Vamps: tired of angst, tired of animal blood, tired of mood swings and rampant smex appeal, tired of black. #ufchat
9:13 am AnassaRh: Weres: tired of male were stand-ins for butch, hairy alpha humans. Liked Oz on Buffy: scrawny, weird, worried about harming others #ufchat
9:16 am AnassaRh: Demons: poss. contradicting myself, but tired of “ugly, evil, animal” and “hot, suave, manipulative”. #ufchat
9:17 am AnassaRh: Then again, I tend to really like manipulative demons (Supernatural, Good Omens, Jill Kismet novels). #ufchat
9:17 am AnassaRh: RT @editorialdept: Readers are more sick of vampire *cliches* than vampires. That’s my experience. Enough brooding and rampant sex appeal, already. #ufchat
9:22 am AnassaRh: Q2a I want scary vampires again, but not only. Must be middle ground btwn “emo” and “scary”?creepy good guy? Violent hero? Schizo? #ufchat
9:24 am AnassaRh: An eg of what I mean is McKinley’s Sunshine. Vamp is creepy, ugly, different morals + perspective, does good things for bad reasons. #ufchat
9:28 am AnassaRh: RT @UF_Chat: @leapetra Agree – more doglike with bad tempers than wolfman monsters (of course actual wolves are pretty civilized in reality!) #UFchat
9:29 am AnassaRh: RT @kjhatch: The shiny vampires and friendly werewolves are the same problem. They’re made too human, weakens the contrast with humanity. #UFchat
9:30 am AnassaRh: Please! And non-Euro too! RT@leapetra: Finding “forgotten” creatures like trolls, berserks, orges, etc, more of those would be great #ufchat
9:32 am AnassaRh: Not sick of werewolves, but I’d like to see some that are genuinely scary or dangerous?or actually like real wolves. #ufchat
9:39 am AnassaRh: Q2c I really like @seananmcguire‘s take on fae, and how she realizes so many different kinds. Also Melissa Marr, for that. #ufchat
9:42 am AnassaRh: Q4 I love that there ARE strong women. Don’t so much love that there’s so much of one type of strong?reactionary, aggressive, hurt. #ufchat
9:43 am AnassaRh: I tend to fall for heroines with brains?the ones that stop, think, plan, worry. More realistic, to me. #ufchat
9:46 am AnassaRh: Tiring of characters who gain powers to keep the series going. Sure, add more, but give a good reason! (Destiny ? reason.) #ufchat
9:56 am AnassaRh: Would like to revisit heroine origins. Don’t want “she just is”. Want explanation up front. I see too much gradual discovery, too. #ufchat
9:57 am AnassaRh: Also, would like regular human heroines, not with powers. Or a human just getting into magic, self-taught, novice? Want struggles. #ufchat
10:01 am AnassaRh: Q4a I’d rather less of both. They strike me as aggressive, arrogant, overprotective as love interests?& they’re not every gal’s type #ufchat
10:03 am AnassaRh: To get on a bit of a soapbox, I get miffed when told alpha male is ONLY acceptable mate. Can heroine go for the beta male? #ufchat
10:05 am AnassaRh: Alpha male or bad-boy heroes, on the other hand, those I’m ok with, as long as they don’t overexert to prove manliness or something. #ufchat
10:06 am jolantru: RT @AnassaRh: Weres: tired of male were stand-ins for butch, hairy alpha humans. Liked Oz on Buffy: scrawny, weird, worried about harming others #ufchat
10:06 am AnassaRh: What about a bad-boy who used to be a good boy? Or a Batman/Bruce Wayne type, bad by night, good(ish) by day? #ufchat
10:08 am RastaN3rd: RT @kjhatch: The shiny vampires and friendly werewolves are the same problem. They’re made too human, weakens the contrast with humanity. #UFchat
10:08 am AnassaRh: Basically, I’d like men who are men, not men who are stereotypes. #ufchat
10:10 am AnassaRh: Q5 I like when weapons make sense for the world’s monsters. Fortunately, in the books I’ve read, I’ve seen this. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:13 am AnassaRh: Repeating myself re: strength + violence, but MCs who shoot first and MCs who get stronger every book aren’t for me, overdone. #ufchat
10:13 am AnassaRh: I actually haven’t met a heroine with a magic sword. Might be interested, just to see. Recs? #ufchat
10:15 am SemaphoreNZ: RT @AnassaRh: Weres: tired of male were stand-ins for butch, hairy alpha humans. Liked Oz on Buffy: scrawny, weird, worried about harming others #ufchat
10:16 am AnassaRh: And yeah, I could do without guns. Even if it’s an awesome gun, it’s kind of ? bland. #ufchat
10:17 am AnassaRh: I think there are lots of swords, guns, spells?what about other weapons? Crossbow, axe, shuriken, morningstar? #ufchat
10:18 am AnassaRh: Or like in Supernatural where every monster requires a different weapon to kill it, so you need experience with a range? #ufchat
10:20 am AnassaRh: Definitely want a Round 2! There’s so much we haven’t discussed, it would be a shame not to. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:26 am AnassaRh: I know I’ve mentioned Supernatural a lot,but the char Ellen? Tough as nails, 50s, never follows, rarely front line?excellent heroine #ufchat
10:27 am AnassaRh: Yes! RT@editorialdept: 1 more quick peeve before we wrap: main characters running away from their destiny/inheritance/family roleetc #ufchat
10:32 am AnassaRh: And that’s it for my #ufchat comments, I think. If I fall asleep at work tomorrow, or fail at writing, I’m blaming the discussion.
10:35 am jolantru: @AnassaRh A crossbow would be great. Or a halberd. #ufchat
10:42 am cassopeia: RT @AnassaRh: I know I’ve mentioned Supernatural a lot,but the char Ellen? Tough as nails, 50s, never follows, rarely front line?excellent heroine #ufchat
11:17 am reviewsandbooks: RT @VampBookClub: Often in UF we get one strong woman, but several strong men. Would it be so bad to have multiple badass women in a single novel? #ufchat
11:17 am reviewsandbooks: RT @VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Urban fantasy has lots of variety & draws a lot of diff. types. Let?s start positive. Q: what do you really LOVE? #UFchat
3:20 pm familiarskylar: I’d like to see that, too! RT @thedragongem I want to see more UF heroes with animal sidekicks/familiars. #UFchat
6:39 pm Jamgrrl: @inkgypsy Will there be a transcript of yesterday’s #UFChat?
9:45 pm inkgypsy: @Jamgrrl Definitely. πŸ™‚ It’ll go up late tonight to allow for any additional comments by people who weren’t able to attend yesterday #UFchat
9:46 pm inkgypsy: . @Jamgrrl You can check here http://bit.ly/aQvjjy for all past transcripts & additional posts. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
August 30, 2010
3:17 am inkgypsy: @JulieeJohnsonn Our last week’s #UFchat dealt with the diff b/w PNR & UF & the crossover. Here’s the transcript http://bit.ly/boSgns

___________________________________

END OF TRANSCRIPT FOR AUGUST 28th, 2010

Already people are scrambling with new ideas & revisiting their WIP’s after this chat!

Next week:

ROUND TWO of Pet Peeves & Wish Lists – we’ll be getting into the really juicy stuff… πŸ˜‰

Feel free to add thoughts and resources during the week as you think them or find them – just use the #UFchat hashtag so I can find them and add them to the discussion & transcript.

The β€œPublished UF authors on Twitter” page for the blog (check the link at the very top of the page) is slowly growing (there are a LOT of UF authors on Twitter!) and it’s and linked it to a list on Twitter for easy following.

If you see someone you think should be on there, there’s a good chance I just haven’t gotten to adding them yet BUT please always feel free to add suggestions by @-ing @inkgypsy and I’ll add them to the list ASAP.

Stay tuned to @UF_Chat on Twitter for countdown’s and updates.

See you next week!

Gypsy (@inkgypsy)


Transcript for Aug 21, 2010: The UF & PNR Overlap with Special Guest Q&A with Patti O’Shea

What a fabulous discussion today! It was very busy but our multi-award winning and bestselling special guest author, Patti O’Shea, did an amazing job of keeping all the questions and answers straight.

Patti O’Shea is the author of the Light Warriors series, the Crimson City series, the Jarved Nine series and many other action paranormal romance/urban fantasy & futuristic books. Her books have won multiple awards including a Beacon Award on August 1st for β€œEdge of Dawn” winning Best Paranormal of 2010! Congratulations Patti! Her books have a wonderful mix of hard action, paranormal and passion.

Again, I’ve added a color coding to aid in reading the topic/question and answer flow and to point out announcements and resources:

YELLOW = official #UFchat statement and questions to be discussed (I left the discussion additions the same as everyone else’s) – this week I’ve also made participant questions Patti replies to YELLOW too. πŸ™‚

PINK = Patti’s responses.

GREEN = #UFchat announcements

BLUE = resources (links, posts and essays relating to today’s topic)

Without further ado, here is the transcript from our chat on Saturday.

TOPIC: The UF/PNR overlap – what’s hot, what’s not, what’s the attraction for readers, for writers, what UF owes romance and more!

AND
a special Q&A with Patti too!
9:48 pm snowppl: RT @inkgypsy: #UFchat Boot time! Going to need gloves today too. 15 mins till the UF vs PNR Q&A smackdown – w bestseller @Patti_OShea! Bring questions!
9:51 pm UF_Chat: Please don’t let Twitter be broken! We’ve got a smackdown happening in 10 minutes! & front row seats too.. #UFchat
9:52 pm Patti_OShea: #UFchat starts in 8 minutes. Brace yourselves!
9:54 pm MetaPhoenix: @Patti_OShea I love when followers need to be warned. So epic! #UFchat
9:55 pm kaitnolan: 545. It’s not great, but it’s words and it meets my minimum just in time for #UFchat Gonna feed the dogs and settle in for FUN!
9:55 pm Queryaddict: RT @UF_Chat: #UFchat Boot time! Going to need gloves today too. 15 mins till the UF vs PNR Q&A smackdown – w bestseller @Patti_OShea! Bring questions!
9:57 pm snowppl: I’m ready for #ufchat. If you’re not participating, you should. @rcmurphy needs to join us.
9:57 pm UF_Chat: Bother – my Tweetdeck backup isn’t cooperating. If there are delays – my apologies – it’s not me. It’s gremlins – seriously. #UFchat
9:57 pm Queryaddict: First time on #ufchat! Excited to see how things work around here πŸ™‚
9:57 pm Patti_OShea: @MetaPhoenix heh. I’m good at epic tweets. I figure I’ll end up in Twitter jail before chat is over. #ufchat
9:57 pm Diane_Amy: I’m new to this chat. All settled in and ready to go! #UFchat
9:58 pm Cameron_Haley: #UFchat in 2.
9:58 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I’m ready for my UF boys! #UFchat
9:58 pm UF_Chat: You heard the lady! (And her boots are serious pro editions!) RT @Patti_OShea: #UFchat starts in 8 minutes. Brace yourselves!
9:58 pm inkgypsy: You heard the lady! (And her boots are serious pro editions!) RT @Patti_OShea: #UFchat starts in 8 minutes. Brace yourselves!
9:58 pm 1hope1dream: *sneaks in and waves* I should be working on one of my WIPs. Instead I’ll come chat for a while. πŸ˜€ #UFchat
9:58 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy haha pssst *I’m a moderator* #justsayin #UFchat
9:59 pm marirandomities: RT @UF_Chat: You heard the lady! (And her boots are serious pro editions!) RT @Patti_OShea: #UFchat starts in 8 minutes. Brace yourselves!
9:59 pm Cameron_Haley: Hi, all! Nice to see all of you again. #UFchat
10:01 pm snowppl: @Cameron_Haley hi! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:01 pm UF_Chat: 3, 2.. and we are LIVE for the #UFchat smackdown today! UF vs PNR (& where they overlap) Welcome! #UFchat
10:01 pm J_GriffinB: hopes no one can see him. Not looking his best. #ufchat
10:01 pm 1hope1dream: RT @inkgypsy: You heard the lady! (And her boots are serious pro editions!) RT @Patti_OShea: #UFchat starts in 8 minutes. Brace yourselves!
10:01 pm UF_Chat: TODAY: The Urban Fantasy (UF) & Paranormal Romance (PNR) overlap. What?s hot, what?s not, what they share, what they don?t. #UFchat
10:01 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat thanks πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:02 pm 1hope1dream: Wow…Alice finished right in time. #UFchat
10:02 pm jeremymcnabb: @J_GriffinB – Don’t worry. It’s #ufchat, not #ufvideochat
10:03 pm UF_Chat: Often meet writers who find selves writing PNR & then start reading. What?s the attraction for writers of PNR as opposed to readers? #UFchat
10:03 pm J_GriffinB: is no longer concerned, thanks to @jeremymcnabb #ufchat
10:04 pm snowppl: @jeremymcnabb thank goodness LOL i’m a mess too #ufchat #ufvideochat
10:04 pm UF_Chat: What writing conventions does urban fantasy owe to the romance influence? Or does it at all? – you tell me. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:04 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat It’s the best of both worlds–the otherworldly we love about UF but also the romance. #UFchat
10:05 pm Queryaddict: my understanding is any romance must have a happy ending, not so much with UF #ufchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @Queryaddict Not all romance has a happy ending. Para-romance simply follows the relationship #UFchat

10:05 pm editorialdept: I think a lot of people like to read a bit of romance – so much the merrier if it’s got paranormal characters. #ufchat
10:06 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat Seems to me it’s all about the relationship and the travails of its maintenance or development. #ufchat
10:06 pm 1hope1dream: @UF_Chat Romance – or at least the pursuit of what they think of as romance – drives people, whether it leads to a happy end or not. #UFchat
10:06 pm elizabethkarr: @snowppl Can you plz send link to get in the room for #UFchat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: So what do you see as difference between UF & PNR? Are they close relatives or actually different beasts sharing paranormal space? #UFchat
10:06 pm tasmin21: I don’t think UF & Romance conventions are alike. Romance would be romance, be it w/ humans or creatures. UF…not so much. #ufchat
10:06 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: From a booksellers’ perspective it’s a bugger. #UFChat
10:06 pm The_Sims_3: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch @1hope1dream Play Sims3 while taking part and watching Alice. #UFchat
10:07 pm J_GriffinB: And uf/para have boundless entities to bounce the romance between #ufchat
10:07 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarr http://tweetchat.com/room/UFchat πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:07 pm snowppl: @elizabethkarr you are in #UFchat just search the hashtag and you’re there!
10:07 pm kaitnolan: PNR has more rigid and specific conventions to follow. Readers expect HEA or HFN and certain behavior of hero/heroine #UFchat
10:07 pm UF_Chat: @Ben_Aaronovitch The ‘where do you shelve it’ question? #UFchat
10:07 pm jeremymcnabb: #UFchat and also, UF might focus more on unique pairings as opposed to workable romances in PNR
10:08 pm J_GriffinB: @elizabethkarr http://tweetchat.com/room/ufchat #ufchat
10:08 pm editorialdept: major diff is UF doesn’t NEED a romantic element. It’s not integral to the genre. Likewise, romantic elements doesn’t = pure romance #ufchat
10:08 pm elizabethkarr: @UF_Chat Thanx 4 link. First time here. Will mostly listen. #UFchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: @kaitnolan What certain behavior as opposed to a UF relationship? (helping to define the differences here) #UFchat
10:08 pm kaitnolan: @jeremymcnabb Disagree. We LOVE our impossible relationships in PNR. #UFchat
10:08 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @kaitnolan HEA? HFN? #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @Ben_Aaronovitch Happily ever after… #UFchat

10:09 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat how do I not know these link things. I suppose @nambu spoils me #UFchat
10:09 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarr Glad to see you! It’ll be a fun one – Patti’s here in just 5 mins to drill, er, Q&A with πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:09 pm pauljessup: @UF_Chat Diff. beasts. Most def. Urban Fantasy come from noir and horror. PR is more Rom centric #UFchat
10:09 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat As in with PNR hero and heroine CAN’T hook up w/ someone else. No cheating. Relationship type rules. #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @kaitnolan Whereas UF is more overcoming outside influences…. Man I am blurring lines right & left in my work. lol #UFchat

10:09 pm editorialdept: It’s possible to have a romantic subplot w/out being bound by convention of happily ever after in UF (and PNR, too?) #ufchat
10:09 pm kaitnolan: @Ben_Aaronovitch Happily ever after or Happily for now. #UFchat
10:09 pm jeremymcnabb: @kaitnolan Haha, but do you love them for the pairing, or for the complicated romance itself? #UFchat
10:09 pm UF_Chat: @Ben_Aaronovitch Happily Ever After. Happily For Now. #UFchat
10:09 pm ellestonewrites: Happily Ever After/ Happy For now #ufchat
10:10 pm jimnduncan: Is there any significant differences beyond the HEA? Certainly a fair amount of romance in UF. #ufchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: @kaitnolan So are there more ‘true’ love triangles in UF than PNR then do you think? #UFchat
10:10 pm kaitnolan: @jeremymcnabb Both. Romance is all about overcoming hardships in the name of love. #UFchat
10:10 pm kaitnolan: @jimnduncan I think the lines are blurred a lot more now than they used to be. #UFchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan UF doesn’t require any romance – it has more now than ever due to romance readers influence – they’re the big buyers. #UFchat
10:11 pm MetaPhoenix: Does anyone consider urban science fiction or SF romance to be under the same umbrella as UF and PNR? #UFchat
10:11 pm Cameron_Haley: In romance, is the protagonist’s story goal always a relationship with the love interest? I don’t actually know. #UFchat
10:11 pm jeremymcnabb: @kaitnolan Like it. Thanks! #UFchat
10:11 pm J_GriffinB: Some of the tropes are overdone, or at least over-exposed. #ufchat
10:11 pm UF_Chat: Q: What are some books that you think blur the line between Urban Fantasy & Paranormal Romance? #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @UF_Chat The Anita Blake series started out UF and became PNR. #UFchat

10:11 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat I think UF tends to have more series where it’s not settled in 1 book. PNR tends to have a resolution of some kind #UFchat
10:11 pm 1hope1dream: @pauljessup I sort of agree with you here. Noir/horror – yes. Also darker, grittier life w/o the touch of classic (gothic) horror. #UFchat
10:11 pm elizabethkarr: Does the HFN imply a sequel in the offing? #UFchat
10:11 pm Cameron_Haley: Is the love triangle a romance convention? #UFchat
10:12 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @kaitnolan #UFchat The motive for the struggle is what makes the difference.
10:12 pm jimnduncan: Well, PNR has or should have more focus on the romantic relationship. UF I think focuses more on the paranormal world they’re in #ufchat
10:12 pm J_GriffinB: @Cameron_Haley I would say it is a literary convention. #ufchat
10:12 pm kaitnolan: @elizabethkarr Well not every book can properly end with wedding bells implied (traditional HEA), hence the HFN #UFchat
10:12 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarr Not necessarily though it’s an oft used way of getting to the next one. bittersweet endings are common in UF. #UFchat
10:12 pm kaitnolan: @jimnduncan I think both had best pay attention to the world, otherwise the setting suffers. #UFchat
10:12 pm jeremymcnabb: @jimnduncan #UFchat world-building VS relationship-building
10:13 pm elizabethkarr: As reader, it’s real pleasure 2 follow characters on diff journeys in subsequent books. 1 of the allures of Grafton and Cornwell #UFchat
10:13 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Buy my book PNR people it’s got some…romance-ish in it. #UFchat
10:13 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan UF does tend to be more plot based – mystery, crime, ticking clock etc – the story is done that that’s solved. #UFchat
10:13 pm UF_Chat: @Ben_Aaronovitch Give us your twitter pitch. #UFchat
10:14 pm J_GriffinB: @kaitnolan Excellent point. #ufchat
10:14 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat Lines are seriously blurring w/ that though. More and more the thing that drives the relationship is circumstance in PNR #UFchat
10:14 pm elizabethkarr: @UF_Chat @kaitnolan Of course. πŸ™‚ First time I’m hearing the term HFN and I like it. Life imitating art. That whole thing. #UFchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: Do we have @Patti_OShea in the house? #UFchat
10:14 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @UF_Chat Harry Potter joins the sweeney. #UFChat
10:15 pm Cameron_Haley: Is it a problem that the lines between PNR and UF are becoming blurred? Or is it a good thing? #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @Cameron_Haley I see it as a good thing. Romance is a very large market. #UFchat

10:15 pm inkgypsy: RT @tasmin21: @Cameron_Haley It’s a very fine line, in a lot of cases./#UFchat
10:15 pm J_GriffinB: @jeremymcnabb heh. #ufchat
10:15 pm Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat I’m here. #ufchat
10:15 pm kaitnolan: @Cameron_Haley That seems to depend on the reader. I love both. Some prefer very specific conventions #UFchat
10:16 pm J_GriffinB: @Patti_OShea Hail! #ufchat
10:16 pm snowppl: @Patti_OShea welcome! πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:16 pm UF_Chat: Time to welcome special guest @Patti_OShea! Pls hold Q’s for her till near end when have open Q’s. Discussion during welcome. #UFchat
10:16 pm UF_Chat: Delighted to welcome @Patti_OShea, bestselling author of action/adv/PNR as special guest for Q&A! Thx for taking Q’s today Patti! #UFchat
10:16 pm thedaisyharris: Hi. #UFchat
10:16 pm UF_Chat: Patti?s latest ?paranormal action romance? is ?In the Darkest Night? & features ?equal parts passion & horror blend?! (review quote) #UFchat
10:17 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @Cameron_Haley I think you can become fixated on genre distinctions, best to write first label second. #UFchat
10:17 pm UF_Chat: Her ?Edge of Dawn? also just won the 2010 Beacon Award for BEST PARANORMAL! Congrats @Patti_OShea! #UFchat
10:17 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Lot of questions! Let?s see how many we get through. ? (Note S = statement followed by related Q & Q= question) #UFchat
10:17 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Hello Patti. #UFchat
10:17 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q1: What came first for you? Were you drawn primarily to romance or the paranormal? #UFchat
10:18 pm thedragongem: I prefer UF. I tend to skip over the romance scenes in most books. #UFchat
10:18 pm UF_Chat: @Ben_Aaronovitch Agree – write first – market 2nd – adjust then IF necessary. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:18 pm 1hope1dream: @Ben_Aaronovitch I agree with you on this one, Ben. Write what you want. Figure out the genre later. #UFchat
10:18 pm Patti_OShea: That’s a chicken/egg question. πŸ™‚ I remember reading books on astrology and other stuff like this in grade school, but I also #ufchat
10:18 pm MetaPhoenix: What adjustments should be made to attract more male readers to PNR? #UFchat
10:18 pm Patti_OShea: remember when I played dolls, Barbie and Ken had a hot romance going on. πŸ™‚ I’ll have to plead having an interest #ufchat
10:18 pm Saffy: Surely UF is a setting/back drop where as PNR is plot? It’s the whole thorny issue of what is Genre again :/ Oh and hello! #UFchat
10:18 pm rixshep: @inkgypsy @tasmin21 @Cameron_Haley IMO, lines getting more blurred between uf, cf, pnr, etc. Only a problem IF confuses readers. #UFchat
10:18 pm Patti_OShea: in both from a young age. #ufchat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: We are just welcoming @Patti_OShea to the ring, er, floor. Please welcome her!#UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @UF_Chat You were right with ring. It’s a circus today! #UFchat

10:19 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q2: What were some early influences on a) your overall writing and b) your specific blend of action/adv PNR? #UFchat
10:19 pm kaitnolan: @Patti_OShea Welcome! And congrats on the Beacon! #UFchat
10:19 pm rixshep: #UFchat Other than confusion to potential new readers, it is ALL fantasy, so is, again imo, a good thing! 8-D
10:19 pm mark_henry: #UFchat Hey y’all!
10:20 pm Cameron_Haley: @Ben_Aaronovitch I agree, but I also don’t want folks like Kari’s hubby to pass by my book cause he thinks it’s too romance centric. #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @Cameron_Haley Guns. That’s the secret. If there is enough action in the romance men won’t notice the romance. #UFchat

10:20 pm jimnduncan: Hey Mark! #ufchat
10:20 pm Patti_OShea: @kaitnolan thank you! #ufchat
10:20 pm Patti_OShea: It’s hard to cite specific influences on my writing because I’ve read voraciously my entire life. Some of my favorite authors #ufchat
10:20 pm UF_Chat: @mark_henry *waves* Patti just stepped into the ring… #UFchat
10:20 pm thedragongem: RT @Saffy: Surely UF is a setting/back drop where as PNR is plot? Its the whole thorny issue of what is Genre again :/ Oh and hello! #UFchat
10:20 pm kaitnolan: @Cameron_Haley Ultimately LIFE is about relationships, so I don’t know why they get all kerfluffled about it. #UFchat
10:20 pm Patti_OShea: It’s hard to cite specific influences on my writing because I’ve read voraciously my entire life. Some of my favorite authors are Linda Howard, Jayne Ann Krentz, and Nora Roberts among many, many others. #ufchat
10:20 pm elizabethkarr: Welcome~v interested peer behind the curtain of your book and writing process. #UFchat
10:20 pm tasmin21: Hi, Mark! #ufchat
10:20 pm Patti_OShea: I think movies are behind my love of action/adv rom because until this decade, most books didn’t have a whole lot of action. #ufchat
10:20 pm rixshep: rt @UF_Chat We r just welcoming @Patti_OShea to the ring, er, floor. Please welcome her! #UFchat / Howdy ma’am! #ufchat
10:21 pm Patti_OShea: At least not what I was finding to read. Hollywood, tho, is filled with movies brimming with action and enough romance to #ufchat
10:21 pm Cameron_Haley: Point being, genres and categories *do* have a role to play. We want our readers to know what to expect. #UFchat
10:21 pm Patti_OShea: keep me watching. #ufchat
10:22 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Can you give us some (Hollywood) examples? (I know the Execs LOVE a romance B plot at the least!) #UFchat
10:22 pm mark_henry: @UF_Chat Awesome. Just hangin’ out. Don’t mind me. #UFchat
10:22 pm elizabethkarr: Often find that great writers are also big readers. Makes sense. #UFchat
10:22 pm MetaPhoenix: Auel’s novel The Valley of Horses is a good example of a romance book that male readers enjoy, though it’s more historical than PN. #UFchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @MetaPhoenix Sherrilyn Kenyon’s books are very action based yet are based entirely around the romance. She has tons of male readers #UFchat

10:23 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea Interesting so the screenply format influenced your writing style. If I understand you correctly. #UFchat
10:23 pm Patti_OShea: I love “Speed” and consider it my favorite romance movie. Also, if Terminator hadn’t had Kyle die, I’d call that a romance, too. #ufchat

FROM @RCMurphy: @Patti_OShea I think I like you so much more now. Action in a romance makes it easier for me to read. #UFchat

10:23 pm rixshep: rt @editorialdept @Ben_Aaronovitch @Cameron_Haley Can get fixated on genre distinctions, write 1st label 2nd #ufchat / Yes plz! More! πŸ˜‰

FROM @RCMurphy: @rixshep Happily ever after/happy for now #UFchat

10:23 pm kaitnolan: @MetaPhoenix I would not at ALL class that as a romance. #UFchat
10:23 pm UF_Chat: @MetaPhoenix Do you think that’s because it’s both explicit & fact heavy or something else? #UFchat
10:23 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q3: Could you please define the difference for us between Paranormal Romance & Urban Fantasy? #UFchat
10:23 pm kaitnolan: @Patti_OShea You totally need to meet my CP. She had me watch Terminator for the romance plot. #UFchat
10:23 pm Patti_OShea: To me, the difference is focus. In PNR, the focus is on the couple and their developing relationship. There’s one hero, one heroine. #ufchat
10:24 pm Patti_OShea: In UF, the focus is on one character, often the heroine, and the world she inhabits. If there’s a romance, it’s usually secondary. #ufchat
10:24 pm J_GriffinB: @UF_Chat both #ufchat
10:24 pm Saffy: @MetaPhoenix *cough* sex scenes! Graphic at least for teenagers #UFchat
10:24 pm mark_henry: What do you think about the “new” sub genre of UF Romance? Does it just cloud the issue further? #UFchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: @kaitnolan Interesting – maybe guy’s idea of a romance? Jondalar (sp?) is a romantic charac but agree – not Ro by my definition. #UFchat
10:24 pm MetaPhoenix: @Patti_OShea Those films do mix adrenaline and romance almost perfectly. #UFchat
10:25 pm AGypsyLove: @MetaPhoenix I think I’d consider Auel’s books romance on a level. It’s hard to narrow them down bc so much going on. #UFchat
10:25 pm kaitnolan: @Saffy Yeah my 9th grade english teacher considered it p0rn #UFchat
10:25 pm MetaPhoenix: I GTG. Been fun. #Ufchat
10:25 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea So UF is more based in reality. That’s how I see it, too. Less escapism fantasy (which is a good thing 2) #UFchat
10:25 pm UF_Chat: @mark_henry Good glory – there’s a ‘new’ sub-genre of UF Romance? Can you comment on that @Patti_OShea? #UFchat
10:26 pm 1hope1dream: @kaitnolan My mother did too and she about had a heart attack when she caught me reading Auel’s books. #UFchat
10:26 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Avoid Bridge to terebithia film trailer effect – OK that came out weird. #UFchat
10:26 pm rixshep: rt @UF_Chat @Ben_Aaronovitch Agree – write first – market 2nd – adjust then IF necessary. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:26 pm ladytechie: @Patti_OShea #UFChat Do you think that the PNR handles sex differently than UF, i.e., explicitness?
10:26 pm J_GriffinB: Pillars of the Earth appears, when a woman tells you about it, to be an historical romance. #ufchat
10:26 pm kaitnolan: @1hope1dream I picked it up thinking it was a horse story. Loved Walter Farley and Margurite Henry. #libraryfail #UFchat
10:27 pm Saffy: @kaitnolan Me and hubby turned out to have both read them whilst really being a bit young :/ #UFchat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q3a: So PNR & UF actually have completely different roots & overlap in the addition of paranormal. Is that right? #UFchat
10:27 pm Patti_OShea: @elizabethkarr TBH, I don’t see much difference in “reality” between UF and PNR. Both tell fantastical stories. #ufchat
10:27 pm LaylaMessner: @mark_henry Is there a new subgenre of UF romance?? (Just got here. Hi everyone.) #UFChat
10:27 pm mark_henry: Some authors have definitely tried to push for that monicker. #ufromance #UFchat
10:27 pm 1hope1dream: @elizabethkarr PNR and UF follow the same ‘reality’, as far as I can tell. They just tend to follow different paths. #UFchat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea – see you just got a bunch of questions. I’ll wait a bit. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:27 pm Carolyn_Haven: RT @Patti_OShea: In UF, the focus is on one character, often the heroine, and the world she inhabits. If there’s a romance, it’s usually secondary. #ufchat
10:28 pm Patti_OShea: Tweet chat is moving fast and I’m missing questions. If I don’t answer, please repeat. #ufchat
10:28 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Make sure your work isn’t marketed under the wrong lable – is what I meant. #UFchat
10:28 pm 1hope1dream: @kaitnolan I saw the movie “Clan of the Cave Bear” at a friend’s house and got dragged into reading the books. #UFchat
10:28 pm jimnduncan: So what do you call a paranormal series with a multi-book romance arc? Is that UF or PNR? #ufchat

FROM PATTI: @jimnduncan If the focus is on the couple, then I’d call it PNR. If the romance is secondary, I’d label it UF.

10:28 pm Cameron_Haley: Yeah, I think the distinction is in what the stories are *about* rather than quantity of reality! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:28 pm KevinHearne: Jumping in and it’s all @mark_henry‘s fault. I’ve heard of paranormal romance, but not UF romance. Why are authors pushing for it? #UFChat
10:28 pm UF_Chat: @mark_henry Interesting – wondering what they thought wasn’t being met by the PNR label. #UFchat
10:28 pm Patti_OShea: I think UF and PNR are 2 pts on the same line. It’s just a matter of where btwn those pts a book falls. #ufchat
10:29 pm kaitnolan: @Saffy Ooops πŸ˜€ #UFchat
10:29 pm LaylaMessner: @mark_henry Just wondering, cause that’s what I’m writing, but I didn’t know it was considered a subgenre. #UFromance #UFChat
10:29 pm Queryaddict: @KevinHearne I’d bet so they can do a cross genre marketing, more readers to interest your book if it covers more ground #ufchat
10:29 pm UF_Chat: @jimnduncan That question is coming but let’s see if @Patti_OShea caught yours. #UFchat
10:29 pm rixshep: rt @Cameron_Haley Point being, genres & categories *do* have role to play. We want readers to know what to expect. #UFchat / Indeed!
10:29 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Presumably, a UF can focus strongly on romantic relationship while still not following romance conventions e.g. HEA/HFN. #UFchat
10:29 pm Patti_OShea: With more UF writers moving toward PNR and more PNR writers moving toward UF, the blurring is substantial. #ufchat
10:29 pm jadettepaige: You sound like me @Patti_OShea remember when I played dolls, Barbie and Ken had a hot romance going on #ufchat
10:29 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea @1hope1dreamWhat I meant is that UF has a wider lens on the character than a narrower focus on romance.Hence more’real’ #UFchat
10:29 pm byharryconnolly: I suspect the diff between PNR and UFRomance is the comfort level of the author. #UFchat Hi, folks!
10:30 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q4: Is that why so many people lump them together? Are there really books that ?blend? the two sub-genres? #UFchat
10:30 pm ladytechie: Do you think that shelving a book in Romance affects its sales in either direction? #UFChat
10:30 pm J_GriffinB: @elizabethkarr hear! hear! #ufchat
10:30 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q4a: Could you give a examples of a successful plot blend? #UFchat
10:30 pm 1hope1dream: @elizabethkarr *nods* That makes sense. #UFchat
10:31 pm kaitnolan: @ladytechie I would think it would turn off men. They’re weird about that. #UFchat
10:31 pm Saffy: @Cameron_Haley What do those acronyms stand for? #UFchat
10:31 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @ladytechie Did in my branch. #UFChat
10:31 pm UF_Chat: @ladytechie Yes – hard to lose on sales if you get shelved in romance – they’re xlnt buyers BUT does mislead other readers. #UFchat
10:31 pm J_GriffinB: RT @Patti_OShea If the focus is on the couple, then Id call it PNR. If the romance is secondary, Id label it UF.<– That’s accurate #ufchat
10:32 pm Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat Yikes! I think the Crimson City series did a pretty good blend (I wrote book 3) of UF and PNR. They came out in 2005 #ufchat
10:32 pm 1hope1dream: @ladytechie More of my HC romance friends have branched into general fantasy and sci fi now that there are more genre based romances #UFchat
10:32 pm rixshep: rt @Patti_OShea With more UF writers moving toward PNR and more PNR writers moving toward UF, the blurring is substantial. #ufchat / Heh!
10:32 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q5: Your books are high on action, not just straight PNR. Do you find that blurs the lines for readers even more? #UFchat
10:32 pm jadettepaige: Yes. That was a big disappointment. @Patti_OShea Also, if Terminator hadn’t had Kyle die, I’d call that a romance, too. #ufchat
10:32 pm Saffy: @kaitnolan @ladytechie Not just men – I don’t go to romance sections – only started reading it as accidently wrote chicklit :/ #UFchat
10:33 pm jimnduncan: I’d expect there are UF readers who never leave the fantasy shelves and never see the romance shelves and vice verse. #ufchat
10:33 pm KevinHearne: What @kaitnolan said?I’m not picking up a book called UF Romance or PNR. (Not writing them either.) πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:33 pm rixshep: @Cameron_Haley Scuse my ignorance of all the terms: hea/hfn? #ufchat
10:33 pm 1hope1dream: RT @Patti_OShea With more UF writers moving toward PNR and more PNR writers moving toward UF, the blurring is substantial. Agreed. #UFchat
10:33 pm Patti_OShea: Yes, I believe it does. I’ve had some romance readers say I don’t write romance, that I write action/adventure fiction. #ufchat
10:33 pm Patti_OShea: To me, my books *are* without question romances. The hero and heroine usually work together and everything that happens #ufchat is about them changing and growing enough to open up to a lifelong relationship. So what if they’re standing back to back and #ufchat
10:33 pm Cameron_Haley: @rixshep hey, I just learned them here! Happily Ever After/Happy for Now #UFchat
10:34 pm kaitnolan: @Saffy Romance is unfairly stigmatized. It’s not as formulaic as it was in the 80s #UFchat
10:34 pm annettepedersen: RT @kaitnolan: I enjoy a story more if it focuses on relationships–not necessarily romantic ones. Action doesn’t happen in an emotional vacuum. #UFchat
10:34 pm Patti_OShea: fighting evil while they’re falling in love? πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea re Kyle (& maybe Crouching Tiger) – is there such a thing as tragic romance? Love declared/returned but death steps in? #UFchat
10:35 pm kaitnolan: @Patti_OShea Which is exactly why I love the blur!!! It kicks ass! #UFchat
10:35 pm 1hope1dream: @Patti_OShea It’s that kind of ‘romance’ I like. The classic formulaic version irritates me for some reason. #UFchat
10:35 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat Hell, I think the entire Highlander franchise was based around tragic love. #ufchat
10:35 pm Saffy: @kaitnolan Unfortunatly the ones I’ve managed to pick up so far have been exactly what I feared :/ I’m still trying though #UFchat
10:35 pm kaitnolan: @1hope1dream Because a lot of old romance has weak heroines. Modern heroines kick butt. #UFchat
10:36 pm Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat No, to be Romance as in the genre, it must have some kind of happy ending. A main character dying would make it a romantic #ufchat story, but not a Romance #ufchat
10:36 pm elizabethkarr: Online burst of reviewing books helped blur genre lines. Crosstalk exposes peeps to books from sections in bookstore prev ignored. #UFchat
10:36 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Seems a lot of Asian cultures corner the market on that – & Shakespeare of course (Romeo/Juliet). #UFchat
10:36 pm rixshep: @Cameron_Haley Ah, cool! Thanks! πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:36 pm Cameron_Haley: And Dracula! RT @tasmin21: @UF_Chat Hell, I think the entire Highlander franchise was based around tragic love. #UFchat
10:36 pm kaitnolan: @elizabethkarr I love that about the internet. #UFchat
10:36 pm J_GriffinB: RT @Patti_OShea: story, but not a Romance<— I have a lot to learn on the genre front. #ufchat
10:36 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Ah – guessing marketing detail important because romance readers NEED the happy resolution? #UFchat
10:37 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q6: What is it about the paranormal that you love? What are ur favorite ways to add a paranormal element to your books? #UFchat
10:37 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat We get kinda crabby if we pick it up expecting a happy resolution and don’t get it w/ no indication of sequel #UFchat
10:37 pm Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat Romance readers will be majorly pissed off if they buy something labeled Romance and the hero or heroine dies. #ufchat
10:37 pm elizabethkarr: @kaitnolan I love that about the internet. < Me, too. Opens lots of new doors & windows. #UFchat
10:37 pm 1hope1dream: @kaitnolan That’s the truth. I’ve read a few modern romances where I liked the heroines. #UFchat
10:38 pm editorialdept: I see a lot of readers being open to crossing genre lines. They appreciate a good story even if it’s outside usual comfort zone. #ufchat
10:38 pm Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat If I pick up fantasy or mystery or SF, I don’t expect there to have to be a happy ending, but Romance. Yes. #ufchat
10:38 pm UF_Chat: Note to #UFchat people: romantic stories and the Romance genre are NOT the same thing. (could be why we get confused) #UFchat
10:38 pm Saffy: @ladytechie The library where I grew up didn’t even have seperate sections for Scifi, horror and fantasy so everything was together #UFchat
10:39 pm Patti_OShea: I love the possibilities of the paranormal. Anything can happen. I also like the fact that the society can be set up in a way that #ufchat
really leaves the hero and/or heroine in a torturous situation. I love to torture my characters. An example would be in my #ufchat
10:39 pm kaitnolan: RT @Patti_OShea: @UF_Chat Rom readers will be pissed off if they buy something labeled Rom & the hero or heroine dies. #wallthumper #UFchat
10:39 pm Patti_OShea: book, EDGE OF DAWN where I have the hero torn between his people and the heroine. He’s in a position where he has to betray #ufchat
10:39 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q7: How do you feel having a paranormal element affects a relationship or romance? #UFchat
10:39 pm Patti_OShea: one or the other, and I don’t think I could get that level of intensity for him and his decision in a regular contemporary world. #ufchat
10:39 pm elizabethkarr: @editorialdept Agree readers open 2 crossing genre lines. Publishers and Studio execs less so. πŸ™‚ We need2 educate them hybrids good #UFchat
10:39 pm Patti_OShea: For me, the paranormal element needs to be organic to the story. If I have to work out how to put it in, then maybe the idea isn’t #ufchat
supposed to be paranormal. And in the PNR I’ve written, the characters have all been something. Half demon, demon, magic users, #ufchat
10:39 pm Saffy: @UF_Chat Ok explain – I can see romatic stories can be within larger story arcs #UFchat
10:39 pm 1hope1dream: @Saffy Same with my libraries. I’ve read from every genre out there, and many of the mixed genre books too. #UFchat
10:39 pm Patti_OShea: vampires. When something is part of the DNA, I don’t have to worry about bringing it in, it’s already there. #ufchat
10:40 pm J_GriffinB: @Patti_OShea I get that, but I hadn’t ben aware of the cold distinction between romance and genres that have an element of romance. #ufchat
10:40 pm Patti_OShea: An author can really go any direction with the paranormal and the romance. It can bring the h/h closer, drive them apart, #ufchat
10:40 pm editorialdept: @elizabethkarr hopefully consumer demand will start to change marketer’s minds re: hybrids #ufchat
10:40 pm Patti_OShea: or not have any impact on them. #ufchat
10:40 pm Patti_OShea: In Crimson Veil, I played it two ways–drawing the h/h together and keeping them apart. The h/h are both half demon and half human, #ufchat
10:40 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q8: Why do you think combining the paranormal & a relationship (or 2) in stories is so popular? What?s the attraction? #UFchat
10:40 pm rixshep: I prefer sf & pure or contemporary fantasy. But can enjoy well written romance in ’em too. ALL (+ uf/pnr) reflects power of myth! #ufchat
10:40 pm Patti_OShea: but while the heroine has embraced her demon half, the hero abhors all demons–even the part of him that is demon. #ufchat
10:41 pm Patti_OShea: So of course they have a bond between them that goes beyond being soul mates. He’s drawn to her wants her more than #ufchat
10:41 pm Patti_OShea: he’s ever wanted any female, but he fights it. Because she’s half demon. And because when he’s with her, the demon part of him #ufchat
10:41 pm Patti_OShea: comes out more strongly. But with IN THE DARKEST NIGHT, the paranormal elements (the hero being a magic-wielding troubleshooter) #ufchat
10:41 pm Patti_OShea: really didn’t play much of a role in the romance. It was why the h/h are together and it played a role in individual growth for both #ufchat
10:41 pm Patti_OShea: characters, but I didn’t see it as affecting their romance very much. #ufchat
10:41 pm LaylaMessner: RT @Patti_OShea: but while the heroine has embraced her demon half, the hero abhors all demons–even the part of him that is demon. #UFChat
10:42 pm Patti_OShea: I’m not sure. Maybe as the real world becomes more and more stressful, people want their fiction to take them farther away #ufchat
10:42 pm J_GriffinB: @Patti_OShea internal conflicts with external effects #ufchat
10:42 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea H/H always need strong obstacle to overcome and paranormal can be that new challenge, maybe 1 not seen before. #UFchat
10:42 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q9: PNR & UF have remained ?hot? long past many predictions. Why do you think that is? Why in this age? #UFchat
10:42 pm Patti_OShea: from reality and paranormal does this. And in a romance, you know that the hero and heroine aren’t going to die during the #ufchat
10:42 pm Patti_OShea: course of the story, that at the end you as a reader are going to feel good. #ufchat
10:42 pm kaitnolan: RT @Patti_OShea: but while the heroine has embraced her demon half, the hero abhors all demons–We love our impossible relationships #UFchat
10:42 pm Patti_OShea: Again, I really think it has to do with the world we live in right now. It can be a scary place. In UF and PNR, the monsters are #ufchat
10:42 pm jadettepaige: @Patti_OShea do you think Laura Croft movies helped move UF higher in awareness with the public? #UFchat
10:42 pm Patti_OShea: generally easy to find because they actually might be monsters. πŸ™‚ The real world is filled with shades of gray and PNR/UF #ufchat tend to be more defined–good versus evil. #ufchat
10:43 pm elizabethkarr: @editorialdept @elizabethkarr hopefully consumer demand will start to change marketer’s minds re: hybrids< See it happening already #UFchat
10:43 pm Saffy: @1hope1dream I actually prefer cross genre :/ #UFchat
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea S: Romance is one of most ?put down? genres yet also has most prolific, adventurous (outside of genre) & loyal readers. #UFchat
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea S: Romance readers discovering PNR cross-over is big reason UF took off so no wonder UF covers lean twd romance. #UFchat
10:43 pm Patti_OShea: @jadettepaige I think so. Same with the Buffy TV show. #ufchat
10:44 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q10: People break covers down PNR= woman facing away UF= woman looking at reader. Is generalization accurate? Thoughts? #UFchat
10:44 pm 1hope1dream: @Patti_OShea Impossible relationships are fun to write about. #UFchat
10:44 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q10a: Speculation is typical covers are more a ‘code’ for loyal readers than marketing to potential ones. Thoughts? #UFchat
10:44 pm 1hope1dream: @Saffy Let’s put it this way…if it’s got fantasy or sci fi elements (no matter what else it has) I’ll at least give it a shot. #UFchat
10:44 pm editorialdept: RT @UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea S: Romance is one of most ?put down? genres yet also has most prolific, outside of genre & loyal readers. #ufchat
10:44 pm Patti_OShea: My PNR covers have always had both the h/h on the front. I’ve also seen a lot–really, really a lot–of PNR covers with just #ufchat
10:44 pm rixshep: rt @Patti_OShea Maybe as real world becomes more stressful, ppl want fiction to take them farther away #ufchat / Escapism IS NOT bad thing!
10:44 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat That’s certainly not the case with my covers. I write PNR and my heroines look @ reader. Heroes look away. #UFchat
10:44 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea “The real world is filled with shades of gray ” < love this. And ironically that what makes it more colorful. #UFchat
10:45 pm Saffy: OK probably really dim question here but what is the difference between UF and Magic Realism? #UFchat
10:45 pm Patti_OShea: facing away. If I had to generalize, I would have said PNR has the hero on the cover (Half dressed) and UF has the heroine. #ufchat
10:45 pm ladytechie: @UF_Chat Indie manager told me 3 weeks ago that men’s backs are the new thing in PNR covers. I did not realize there was a trend #UFChat.

FROM @RCMurphy:

@ladytechie J.R. Ward uses a lot of male backs for her Black Dagger Brotherhood covers. #UFchat

10:46 pm elizabethkarr: @rixshep Maybe as real world becomes more stressful, ppl want fiction to take them farther away< You’re onto something there. #UFchat
10:46 pm LaylaMessner: RT @Patti_OShea: If I had to generalize, I would have said PNR has the hero on the cover (Half dressed) and UF has the heroine. #UFChat
10:46 pm jeremymcnabb: @UF_Chat Briggs’ Mercedes Thompson series alternates between “toward” and “away” #UFchat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: @Saffy That’s another thin line – more to do with marketing – plus many types of UF. literary UF has lots in common with MagicRealsm #UFchat
10:46 pm editorialdept: @Saffy Magical realism tends to be much more “reality” w/ magic sprinkled on top. UF is bold in focus on fantasy elements #ufchat
10:46 pm jadettepaige: Which is why I love Romance. @Patti_OShea And in a romance, you know that the hero and heroine aren’t going to die during the #ufchat
10:46 pm Patti_OShea: If I missed any questions, please re-ask it. #ufchat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea S: PNR is also often credited w bridging gap for guys to read romance. #UFchat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q11: Why do you think that is? #UFchat
10:47 pm LaylaMessner: RT @jadettepaige: in a romance, you know that the hero and heroine arent going to die during the #UFChat
10:47 pm Patti_OShea: My theory is that a lot of guys wouldn’t be caught dead in the romance section, πŸ™‚ but the fantasy section is A-OK. So they picked #ufchat
10:47 pm Patti_OShea: up UF, discovered women writers are good, went looking for more books like UF and ended up with some PNR. I’ve had some #ufchat
10:48 pm rixshep: RT @editorialdept: @elizabethkarr hopefully consumer demand will start to change marketer’s minds re: hybrids #ufchat
10:48 pm Patti_OShea: bookstores put my books in the fantasy section and I’ve heard from male readers who found my books there and liked them. #ufchat
10:48 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea S: Also clear Romance readers have influenced writing relationships in UF, especially with regard to sex. #UFchat
10:48 pm Saffy: @editorialdept @UF_Chat Hmmmm this is why I made phase diagrams to cope with genres they are end points not catagories :/ #UFchat thanks
10:48 pm Patti_OShea: Also, at Amazon and other online bookstores, there aren’t sections and books can get tagged with more than one category. #ufchat
10:48 pm Patti_OShea: There’s also readers who bought this also bought… Some of those UF titles have PNR recs on the page. #ufchat
10:48 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q12: Newbie writers to UF & PNR gravitate to writing either a ?Madonna? or a ?Whore?. Thoughts on why? #UFchat
10:48 pm elizabethkarr: Adding paranormal obstacle ups the ante. eg Twilight-Consummation=Death of being human.Hard 2 top that as something to keepH/H apart #UFchat
10:48 pm kaitnolan: @Patti_OShea Do you think the advent of ebooks will see more folks reading PNR b/c nobody can see the covers and judge? #UFchat
10:49 pm Patti_OShea: I’m not sure why that is unless it’s related to stereotypes in some way. It’s easier to write a type than to really dig in and #ufchat
10:49 pm J_GriffinB: RT @Patti_OShea: bookstores put my books in fantasy section and Ive heard from male readers who found my books there & liked. true #ufchat
10:49 pm Patti_OShea: get to know your characters well enough to get past labels. #ufchat
10:49 pm ladytechie: @Patti_OShea Do you think the guys would have not read them if someone had sent them to romance to pick them up? #UFChat
10:50 pm Patti_OShea: @kaitnolan I think it’s going to help a lot. Some of my own covers have embarrassed me. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:50 pm LaylaMessner: This is a literalization of the sex/love as death metaphor, I think. RT @elizabethkarr: Twilight-Consummation=Death of being human. #UFChat
10:50 pm rixshep: rt @elizabethkarr @editorialdept Agree readers open 2 crossing genres. Publishers/Studios less so. Educate ’em: hybrids good! #UFchat /Yes!
10:50 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q14: Do you have tips on how to NOT fall into the clichΓ© trap when writing relationships? #UFchat
10:50 pm LaylaMessner: RT @Patti_OShea: get to know your characters well enough to get past labels. #UFChat
10:50 pm Cameron_Haley: Can we get some examples of the “Madonna” and “Whore” generalization. I guess I haven’t noticed that… #UFchat
10:50 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy Tell me about it! #UFchat
10:50 pm Patti_OShea: @ladytechie I think men automatically think sappy when they see romance. There are a lot of us who don’t write sappy. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:51 pm Patti_OShea: I’m not sure that holds true anymore. The Hamilton books have a lot more sex in them than a lot of PNR, but her books are still UF. #ufchat
10:51 pm Patti_OShea: I have a lot of fight scenes and action scenes in my books, but I’d still say they’re PNR. I think writers just need to write their #ufchat
10:51 pm Patti_OShea: story and worry about categorizing it after they’re finished. #ufchat
10:51 pm MartinsSecrets: RT @elizabethkarr: Adding paranormal obstacle ups the ante. eg Twilight-Consummation=Death of being human.Hard 2 top that as something to keepH/H apart #UFchat
10:51 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy I haven’t seen you. I have no idea why! 😦 #UFchat
10:52 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Going to skip ahead om the questions as we’re running out of time & want to get to some in particular. #UFchat
10:52 pm Patti_OShea: @J_GriffinB I hear my characters so distinctly in my head, that I haven’t worried about holding voice. They’re tyrants. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:52 pm Jinxie_G: @Patti_OShea I totally agree with that! It’s how I write. #UFChat
10:52 pm LaylaMessner: RT @Patti_OShea: I hear my characters so distinctly in my head, that I havent worried about holding voice. Theyre tyrants. πŸ™‚ #UFChat
10:52 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q15: Appear UF has ?supernaturals? 4 MCs & love interests. PNR tends to male supes only. Why not many PNR supe females? #UFchat
10:53 pm Saffy: Tis way past my bedtime – glad I could catch part of this chat – thanks #UFchat @Patti_OShea
10:53 pm Patti_OShea: Wow, really? Guess I’ve been doing it wrong. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:53 pm ladytechie: I just want what I expect to be in there. I always said why mess up a good murder with a bunch of love junk. LOL #UFChat
10:53 pm Patti_OShea: I’m immediately thinking through the books I’ve read and I’m coming up with stories in PNR with the heroine a vampire, werewolf, #ufchat angel or whatever. I remember stories better than titles, but Maggie Shayne wrote female vampires back in the Silhouette Shadows #ufchat
10:53 pm rixshep: rt @kaitnolan @Patti_OShea Do u think books will see more folks reading PNR b/c nobody can see covers & judge? #UFchat / Heh! Probably!
10:53 pm 1hope1dream: RT @Patti_OShea: I hear my characters so distinctly in my head, that I havent worried about holding voice. Theyre tyrants. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:54 pm Patti_OShea: days and Rebecca Flanders in that same line. Mid 90s maybe? If this really is the trend, I can guess it has to do with making the #ufchat hero alpha. It’s much easier to have an alpha vampire hero and a human heroine who needs his protection than it is to have a #ufchat
10:54 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy yes! you should! @twitter should listen #UFchat
10:54 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat Maybe it’s a desire in romance for a larger than life/reality lover? I seem to be missin those books. #UFchat
10:54 pm Patti_OShea: vampire heroine and an alpha human hero. πŸ™‚ Like I said, it was an interesting experience when I wrote IN THE #ufchat
10:54 pm Patti_OShea: MIDNIGHT HOUR. I think I pulled it off, but it definitely wasn’t the easiest writing I’ve ever done. #ufchat
10:54 pm Patti_OShea: In UF where the heroines are expected to kick butt, it’s easier to have her be supernatural. I’m just guessing here on the whys. #ufchat
10:55 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q16: UF r/ships often happen over series. Does PNR require relationship resolution 4 each book or is multi-book arc OK? #UFchat
10:55 pm Patti_OShea: I don’t see why there couldn’t be a PNR with a romance arc that encompasses three books. Personally, as a reader, I prefer #ufchat
10:55 pm Patti_OShea: to have at least some kind of resolution at the end of each book, but Jayne Ann Krentz did this beautifully in a four book #ufchat
10:55 pm Patti_OShea: series of romances. They’re out of print and really hard to find. I spent years tracking them down before I found all of them, #ufchat
10:56 pm Patti_OShea: but the HEA (Happily Ever After) doesn’t happen until the end of the 4th book, but IIRC there were small resolutions between the h/h #ufchat
10:56 pm Patti_OShea: at the end of each book. Like they decide they have something special at the end of book 1 and are going to date exclusively. #ufchat
10:56 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q17: B/c U blend hard action w romance what must U take into account writing fights/action 2 keep relationship central? #UFchat
10:56 pm Patti_OShea: I can’t remember all the smaller resolutions, but they were enough that left the romance open with more to go, but enough #ufchat that I, as a reader, felt satisfied. The series name, BTW, is Guinevere Jones and she wrote them under the name #ufchat
10:56 pm elizabethkarr: i think y paranormal genre growing is it taps into a morphic resonance of unease & uncertainty felt by much of us humans. #UFchat
10:56 pm Patti_OShea: ayne Castle. The first in the series is “Desperate Game.” #ufchat
10:57 pm mark_henry: @UF_Chat That’s where “urban fantasy romance” proponents stand. Romance is over arc, no HEA. But needs a better name. #UFchat
10:57 pm kaitnolan: @elizabethkarr I figure it is as simple as the fact that in tough economic times, real life sucks and paranormal is total escape #UFchat
10:57 pm Patti_OShea: I rarely have my h/h apart, so they’re usually fighting together or fighting to defend the other. Having them worried about #ufchat
each other is how I keep the relationship a priority while all the other stuff is happening. #ufchat
10:57 pm Patti_OShea: When I do have them apart, they’re thinking of each other. Like in MIDNIGHT HOUR, Deke thinks he hears Ryne calling for help, #ufchat
10:57 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea You have totally whetted my appetite to read Jayne Ann Kretz. #UFchat
10:57 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy i’m sorry! #UFchat
10:58 pm Patti_OShea: so he goes outside to rescue her, only to find he was lured from safety by a creature who mimicked her voice. The fight goes on #ufchat for a few pages and then Ryne’s there and they’re both worrying about each other. #ufchat
10:58 pm snowppl: RT @RCMurphy Ugh. I should have checked before the chat. I had some good things to say since PNR & UF mixed are my “thing”. #UFchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: @mark_henry Ah – but they still require the HEA then? Bittersweet doesn’t qualify? #UFchat
10:58 pm Patti_OShea: It really can be a balancing act if the scenes happen while they’re apart. Yes, they can think about their heroine (or hero), #ufchat
10:58 pm Patti_OShea: but when the fight is getting nitty gritty, they’d be an idiot to lose focus without a good reason. #ufchat
10:58 pm rixshep: @Saffy @editorialdept @UF_Chat => “made phase diagrams to cope with genres” <= Got any examples? Sounds neat! #UFchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q18: What other unusually labeled subgenres would we find your bks in? (ie where else should we be looking?) #UFchat
10:59 pm elizabethkarr: @kaitnolan You got that right! Tough times, we want escape. And best ways are books, movies (and sex). #UFchat
10:59 pm KevinHearne: @mark_henry I second that. UF suggests action, not romance, and that’s what readers expect. #UFChat
10:59 pm Patti_OShea: If you’re asking where I’m shelved in the bookstore, mostly in romance with a few also sticking me in Fantasy/SF. If you’re #ufchat
10:59 pm Patti_OShea: talking about what other genres I wander into either intentionally or unintentionally, I guess horror. Although I never think of #ufchat
10:59 pm mark_henry: @UF_Chat That seems to be their point. Still confuses. #UFchat
10:59 pm Patti_OShea: my books like this, I have had reviewers frequently use the label horror. I also guess I regularly have romantic suspense #ufchat
10:59 pm Patti_OShea: elements in my books as well. #ufchat
11:00 pm jimnduncan: guess my series might qualify as uf romance then, with a multi-book relationship arc, but focus is still on paranormal goings on. #ufchat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q19: What series/books are you working on right now? When can we expect your next book? #UFchat
11:00 pm snowppl: @RCMurphy well you could use the twitter site. #UFchat
11:01 pm J_GriffinB: Q: Do you consider yourself a Fantasy writer, then or UF/PNR? #ufchat
11:01 pm Patti_OShea: I have two series proposals being shopped around right now and two or three more I’d like to work on, but right now I’m #ufchat
11:01 pm Patti_OShea: writing a Nocturne Bites. This is Harlequin’s line for PNR short stories. The working title is SHADOW’S CARESS and I don’t #ufchat
11:01 pm Patti_OShea: have a release date yet. The hero is a shade because the heroine who was a vampire hunter didn’t follow all the steps it #ufchat
11:01 pm Patti_OShea: would take to kill him. He needs her to pull the stake so he can return to his life as the undead. So far she’s been shot at #ufchat
11:01 pm Patti_OShea: and driven her car through a railway crossing with the train bearing down on her. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
11:02 pm elizabethkarr: This has been eyeopening. In my mind Syfy & Romance were 2 distinct genres. Subplots yes, but mostly 1 or other. V enlightening. #UFchat
11:02 pm Patti_OShea: @J_GriffinB I call myself a PNR author because my focus is on the romance even though I have a lot of other stuff going on, too. #ufchat
11:02 pm rixshep: rt @elizabethkarr i think y paranormal genre growing is taps into morphic resonance of unease/uncertainty felt by much of us. #UFchat
11:02 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea Now that’s a premise! Run pitch that to a movie studio! πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Q20: While we’re waiting for your next book, what other UF &/or PNR books do you recommend we read? #UFchat
11:03 pm J_GriffinB: @Patti_OShea so we won’t see you at World Fantasy? #ufchat
11:03 pm Patti_OShea: I’ve mostly been reading nonfiction lately, but I have read the first 3 books in Laura Anne Gilman’s Retriever’s series and #ufchat
11:03 pm Patti_OShea: really liked them. They’re third person (which I prefer to read over first person) and UF titles. The heroine is a magic #ufchat user who’s also a Retriever (thief). #ufchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarr I thin@Patti_OShea‘s books would work brilliantly as movies – if they kept her edge! #UFchat
11:03 pm ladytechie: @Patti_OShea Is it fair to try and have it all in there or is one type of fan bound to be disappointed when an author attempts that? #UFChat
11:04 pm Patti_OShea: @J_GriffinB πŸ™‚ I haven’t gone to any conferences/conventions for the last few years, so no, I’m afraid not. #ufchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarry (Take II) I think @Patti_OShea‘s books would work brilliantly as movies – if they kept her edge! #UFchat
11:04 pm LaylaMessner: Gotta run. Thanks @Patti_OShea and everyone :). #UFChat
11:04 pm snowppl: Okay, have to leave for #free dinner. Can’t pass that up! See you all later! #ufchat
11:04 pm J_GriffinB: @Patti_OShea shucks. #ufchat
11:05 pm elizabethkarr: @UF_Chat I thin@Patti_OShea‘s books would work brilliantly as movies – if they kept her edge!<W/ right producer they will. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:05 pm Patti_OShea: @ladytechie Sometimes I think I make no one happy. Some complain there isn’t enough romance, others complain there’s too much Rom. #ufchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: Over to you guys! Did I miss a question you wanted to ask? @Patti_OShea now. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:05 pm kaitnolan: @Pattie_OShea Which is your favorite of your books? #UFchat
11:06 pm 1hope1dream: I’ve got an odd question. What makes UF/PNR different from horror? Or are they similar genres? #UFchat
11:06 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea Remember Lincoln. U can plz some folks all the time, all folks some of time, but u cant plz all folks all the time. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea By your awards & best sellers (& how library always has your books on waiting lists) I think people are very happy. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:07 pm Patti_OShea: @kaitnolan My favorite book is always the last one that’s completely finished. πŸ™‚ In this case, IN THE DARKEST NIGHT. #ufchat
11:07 pm tasmin21: @1hope1dream My theory: In UF, the supernatural is the world. In Horror, the supernatural is the plot. #ufchat
11:07 pm ellestonewrites: Thanks @Patti_OShea Great chat! #ufchat
11:07 pm inkgypsy: @Patti_OShea RT @1hope1dream: I’ve got an odd question. What makes UF/PNR different from horror? Or are they similar genres? #UFchat
11:07 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea Have u considered adapting books into film? Is that a goal? #UFchat
11:07 pm Patti_OShea: @ellestonewrites thank you! #ufchat
11:08 pm ladytechie: @tasmin21 Good one! #UFChat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: That’s all have time for today! Thx for joining & thank you @Patti_OShea for being so generous with your time & answering questions. #UFchat
11:08 pm Patti_OShea: I’m happy to stick around and answer any questions y’all still have. And if I missed an earlier question, please repost. #ufchat
11:08 pm Patti_OShea: @elizabethkarr I’d like to see my books made into movies, but I’ve no plans to write my own adaptations. #ufchat
11:09 pm Patti_OShea: @1hope1dream I haven’t read enough horror to know the answer to this question #ufchat
11:09 pm inkgypsy: RT @tasmin21: @1hope1dream My theory: In UF, the supernatural is the world. In Horror, the supernatural is the plot. #ufchat
11:09 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea @UF_Chat Thank you. Great to be in the room. Excellent conversation. #UFchat
11:10 pm Patti_OShea: @elizabethkarr thank you! #ufchat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: Patti is generously offering to hang out for a bit and answer some more questions. Throw them in! #UFchat
11:10 pm kaitnolan: @Patti_OShea Great chat! Thanks for coming! #UFchat
11:10 pm 1hope1dream: @tasmin21 That’s an interesting point. #UFchat
11:10 pm rixshep: @Patti_OShea Btw, I found your answers (and resulting convos) to be excellent, even if I couldn’t keep up w/all of them! Thanks! #ufchat
11:10 pm 1hope1dream: @Patti_OShea Thanks for answering our questions! #UFchat
11:10 pm Patti_OShea: @tasmin21 thank you! #ufchat
11:11 pm Patti_OShea: @rixshep Thank you! It is hard to keep up, isn’t it? I’m worried I missed questions. #ufchat
11:11 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea (2 more?) Q: Why do you think ?alpha males? are popular and are they really as popular as some make them out to be? #UFchat
11:11 pm Patti_OShea: @1hope1dream you’re welcome! Thanks for coming to the chat! #ufchat
11:12 pm Patti_OShea: Alpha heroes are hugely popular from what I see. My whole theory is that the stronger the heroine is, the stronger the hero needs #ufchat
11:12 pm Patti_OShea: to be and vice versa. When I read, I want to see the hero out kicking butt with the heroine, not home watching the stock #ufchat
11:12 pm kaitnolan: @UF_Chat I think it’s because in fiction you can have an alpha and get the fantasy but IRL an alpha would be hard to live with. #UFchat
11:12 pm elizabethkarr: @Patti_OShea That’s smart to focus on novels whch you excel at. Adapting novels into screenplays is whole other skill set. #UFchat
11:12 pm Patti_OShea: reports while his heroine is risking her life. Also, when you see one character (whether is the hero or the heroine) who’s really #ufchat
11:12 pm Patti_OShea: alpha and you see them with some beta character, don’t you think, “what do you see in her/him?” I know I do. #ufchat
11:13 pm Patti_OShea: I like a partnership of equals. When I wrote IN THE MIDNIGHT HOUR, my hero was human and my heroine was a #ufchat
11:13 pm rixshep: Well, time to head out (dinner is ready!), but I’ll check later to see the late comments. Still hoping to see some phase diagrams! #ufchat
11:13 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea I’m tweeting your website & more but if people have questions, feedback etc how can they contact you? #UFchat
11:13 pm pattioshea: I just got put in Twitter Jail. Using a second account to answer #ufchat
11:14 pm pattioshea: magic-wielding, butt-kicking troubleshooter. But he’s still alpha. He’s an ex-LAPD officer and a PI. He doesn’t take well to sitting #ufchat
11:14 pm pattioshea: on the sidelines and I made sure to show his frustration with having to stand back and let the heroine fight the battles. I alsomade #ufchat
11:14 pm pattioshea: sure he had a couple of opportunities to fight on his own to show he is alpha. They balanced each other in an interesting #ufchat
11:14 pm pattioshea: way with Deke being the more emotionally grounded. #ufchat
11:15 pm pattioshea: They can @reply me @Patti_OShea or email me patti@pattioshea.com #ufchat
11:15 pm 1hope1dream: Time for me to escape from the chats and get back to the WIP. Later all! #UFchat
11:15 pm UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea Seriously awesome answers & food for thought! Thank you SO much for your time today. We wish you only best sellers! #UFchat
11:15 pm Jamgrrl: Interesting. RT @tasmin21: @1hope1dream My theory: In UF, the supernatural is the world. In Horror, the supernatural is the plot. #ufchat
11:16 pm UF_Chat: That?s a wrap for our special Q&A on PNR & UF today! #UFchat
11:16 pm UF_Chat: Transcript 4 today?s chat on UF/PNR overlap will be on #UFchat blog within 36hrs (apocalypses excepted). Follow @UF_Chat 4 updates! #UFchat
11:16 pm tasmin21: Great chat, folks! I’m off to do domestic stuffs. #ufchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: Next will be tweeting LINKS on/about @Patti_OShea?s books: #UFchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: Patti?s website (actionrom.com) w xlnt blog on writing characters & relationships & much more http://bit.ly/9gWXHO #UFchat
11:17 pm 1hope1dream: Before I run, one more comment here…I don’t care what the subgenre is. It’s ALL speculative fiction and it’s all good. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: A guest post by @Patti_OShea on the importance of relationships in her books & deleting scenes http://bit.ly/13rJK4 #UFchat
11:17 pm UF_Chat: Patti O?Shea?s Oooh Moment at the Paranormal Romance Blog http://bit.ly/cBEDWH #UFchat
11:18 pm UF_Chat: @1hope1dream Agreed! #UFchat
11:18 pm UF_Chat: Awesome interview with Patti O?Shea at Bitten By Paranormal Romance http://bit.ly/cTZjd2 #UFchat
11:20 pm UF_Chat: Patti’s website also has a bunch of excerpts you can read -get a preview piece of the action (& the love) http://www.pattioshea.com/ #UFchat
11:20 pm UF_Chat: To be tweeted next: some resources discussing Paranormal Romance and Urban Fantasy together: #UFchat
11:21 pm UF_Chat: Because It?s Shiny by @ShilohWalker http://bit.ly/bfbptg (Why she writes PNR) #UFchat
11:21 pm UF_Chat: Editorial Roundtable: The Roots of Paranormal Romance/Urban Fantasy (for Tor.com blog) http://bit.ly/caJoFu #UFchat
11:21 pm UF_Chat: What Is Paranormal Romance? By Paul Guran (for Juno books) http://bit.ly/coiSIZ #UFchat
11:22 pm UF_Chat: Books That Blur the Line: Pt 1 by Rebecca @ Dirty Sexy Books http://bit.ly/aHzz3V #UFchat
11:22 pm UF_Chat: Books That Blur the Line: Pt 2 by Abigail @ All Thing Urban Fantasy http://bit.ly/aLJrzd #UFchat
11:22 pm UF_Chat: Upcoming TOPIC: UF – The Good, the Bad & the Untapped: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves & Wish Lists #UFchat
11:23 pm UF_Chat: We are slowly making a list of UF authors on Twitter on #UFchat blog site. Please suggest more @inkgypsy or @snowppl #UFchat
11:23 pm elizabethkarr: Enjoyed meeting u all. I’m film producer of @rfamovie. Adaptation of Philip K Dick novel, http://www.radiofreealbemuth.com #UFchat
11:24 pm UF_Chat: Aug 21 #UFchat session going dark. πŸ˜‰ Transcript available on #UFchat‘s blog in 36hrs-ish, allowing for late comments to be added. #UFchat
11:25 pm UF_Chat: @elizabethkarr Nice to see you today! Thank you for joining us (& please consider @Patti_OShea‘s bks for a film! πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
11:25 pm MartinsSecrets: RT @elizabethkarr: Enjoyed meeting u all. I’m film producer of @rfamovie. Adaptation of Philip K Dick novel, http://www.radiofreealbemuth.com #UFchat
11:27 pm elizabethkarr: @UF_Chat am excited to read @patti_oshea books. New 2 twitter, I’m amazed at all the wonders out there, including #UFchat
11:31 pm inkgypsy: @MRDunn12 Plenty OK to lurk! There’s so much to read & keep up with! Just say hi so we know you’re there. πŸ™‚ Thanks tons for coming. #UFchat
11:34 pm UF_Chat: Tons info in today’s #UFchat! (check hashtag) Like mini-conference! Thx to @Patti_OShea for the awesome. Late comments welcome(use hashtag).
11:34 pm inkgypsy: Tons info in today’s #UFchat! (check hashtag) Like mini-conference! Thx to @Patti_OShea for the awesome. Late comments welcome(use hashtag).
11:40 pm Tartipants: RT @kaitnolan @Patti_OShea Great chat! Thanks for coming! #UFchat http://foook.com
11:42 pm jensenmary30: my books like this, I have had reviewers frequently use the label horror. I also guess I regularly have romantic suspense #ufchat
August 22, 2010
12:23 am rixshep: RT @1hope1dream: Before I run, one more comment here…I don’t care what the subgenre is. It’s ALL speculative fiction and it’s all good. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
1:53 am inkgypsy: 101 weapons for women (from 1991!) Actually, this is good story stuff… http://bit.ly/aVS3DE #UFchat #fightscenes
7:53 am AnassaRh: Suspect I’ll be pretty quiet on the #ufchat comments tonight. Not familliar with romance, paranormal or otherwise.
8:49 am AnassaRh: @Saffy A friend reads lots of magic realism, describes it as “reality made magical”. Dreams, altered states, coincidences, etc. #ufchat
11:27 am kltworld: I wasn’t able to participate, but I read through many of the comments for last night’s #UFchat. Great information! Thanks!
5:45 pm tadbo: RT @UF_Chat: Editorial Roundtable: The Roots of Paranormal Romance/Urban Fantasy (for Tor.com blog) http://bit.ly/caJoFu #UFchat
8:45 pm sarahmakela: RT @tasmin21: I dont think UF & Romance conventions R alike. Romance wld be romance, be it w/ humans or creatures. UF…not so much. #ufchat

___________________________________

END OF TRANSCRIPT FOR AUGUST 21st, 2010

Thanks for a great chat everyone! Hopefully we cleared up some questions, opened some doors and sparked some ideas. (Why do I have the feeling a lot of people will be re-watching Terminator this week? πŸ˜‰

Be sure to check out Patti’s links, the resource posts/essays and more tweeted at the end of the chat time.

The β€œPublished UF authors on Twitter” page for the blog (check the link at the very top of the page) is slowly growing (there are a LOT of UF authors on Twitter!) and it’s and linked it to a list on Twitter for easy following.

If you see someone you think should be on there, there’s a good chance we just haven’t gotten to adding them yet BUT please always feel free to add suggestions by @-ing @inkgypsy or @snowppl and we’ll add them to the list ASAP.

Stay tuned to @UF_Chat on Twitter for details on next week’s topic.

See you next week!

Gypsy (@inkgypsy)


Chat Topic & Special Guest Author Q&A: August 21st, 2010

Here’s the big topic we’ll be discussing with our special guest multi-award winning and bestselling paranormal action romance & futuristic urban fantasy author Patti O’Shea (Saturday August 21):

TOPIC: The UF/PNR overlap – what’s hot, what’s not, what’s the attraction for readers, for writers, what UF owes romance and more!

AND
a special Q&A with Patti too!
See what people are saying about her latest book “In the Darkest Night”.

O’Shea’s fourth Light Warriors romance is a riveting thrill ride that will keep her readers enthralled.

~Publishers Weekly (Starred review!)

O’Shea has another winner. Equal parts passion and horror blend to create one great read.

~RT Book Reviews

I loved everything about this book. The action was fast-paced, the plotting intricate and well-written, and the characterization and dialogue spot-on.

~Riley’s Reviews

The latest Light Warrior romantic urban fantasy is a terrific action-packed thriller.

~Alternative Worlds

In the Darkest Night by Patti O’Shea is a wonderful action packed urban fantasy novel. O’Shea is a magical story teller who can make you believe you are living the story with the characters.

~Literary Escapism

Patti O’Shea delivers an intriguing paranormal romance ripe with complex characters and danger with IN THE DARKEST NIGHT. Don’t miss it!

~Romance Reviews Today

IN THE DARKEST NIGHT is a well-written and fast paced book. It continues the great series of the Light warriors. Patti O’shea is a great author no matter what she is writing her characters are well rounded and always full of emotion making the reader love each and every one of them.

~Fresh Fiction

We have a TON of questions and I’m sure you do too (bring them all!) – this Paranormal Romance/Urban Fantasy cross-over issue can get very confusing…. come discuss & pick Patti’s brain.
πŸ™‚

Patti’s books have won multiple awards including a Beacon Award on August 1st for “Edge of Dawn” winning Best Paranormal of 2010! Congratulations Patti! Her books have a wonderful mix of hard action, paranormal and passion.

Patti O’Shea is the author of the Light Warriors series, the Crimson City series, the Jarved Nine series and many other action paranormal romance/urban fantasy & futuristic books!

Throw in your thoughts and questions on how Paranormal Romance and Urban Fantasy overlap – what the commonalities are, what the differences are and why even ‘dark UF’ people should be aware of Paranormal Romance – it’s not as cut and dried as it first appears.

TODAY @ 3pm PST/ 6pm EST!

Follow @UF_Chat for updates and reminders.

See you in a few hours!


UF Related Tweets & Links on Twitter Last Week (Aug 8-14th)

Here are a bunch of tweets, links and posts related to UF that were spotted this past week, including articles, free reads, a couple of funnies and more:

Mdesmondobrien: RT @UF_Chat: Grounding Fantasy in Reality by Laura Bickle http://bit.ly/c0st90 #ufchat

ahugheswriter: RT @AudryT: @AuthorWilliam Most humans are too egotistical to accept that other intelligent life-forms might also be native. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat

Patti_OShea: RT @inkgypsy: Announcement: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFChat

7:13 pm Jinxie_G: @LeanneBennett #UFChat is where we discuss urban fantasy, as readers and/or writers. Everyone is welcome.
8:06 pm rixshep: @goodlaura #ufchat is a weekly twitter chat about urban fantasy in all of its various genre associations. Saturdays, 3pm pst. See @UF_Chat.
9:08 pm goodlaura: @rixshep @kjhatch Thanks for explaining! Would #eureka or #beinghuman fall into category of #ufchat?
10:26 pm rixshep: @goodlaura Good question for nxt #ufchat! I don’t mind blurring some scifi/fantasy lines in certaion cases, myself. Orthers may disagree.
10:29 pm rixshep: @goodlaura I see #sanctuary, #eureka, #fringe, etc. as on the edges of uf. #ufchat
10:34 pm goodlaura: @rixshep @kjhatch Thank you for helping me to better understand urban fantasy today! #ufchat

UF_Chat: Native Americans in Urban Fantasy (a list) #UFchat http://bit.ly/cjb4AH

UF_Chat: Indie Paranormal Romance & UF books (A reader’s Amazon listmania list – not mine) http://amzn.to/bl9BN8 #UFchat

kjhatch: This is why there are no fat vampires http://bit.ly/bXYeZ4 #vampires #ufchat #funny

inkgypsy: Interesting post: “Why I Read Urban Fantasy” by @kiaras http://bit.ly/9vCpsB #UFchat #fantasytalk #Flitchat #scifichat #horror

inkgypsy: Wall Street Cyclops http://bit.ly/cHITKt by Charles Santoso http://bit.ly/cwETeC #UFchat #fantasytalk

UF_Chat: RT @BellaPagan: FREE ch of DEATH MOST DEFINITE lunchtime read. Reaping -tough job but someone’s gotta do it! http://bit.ly/caHqPG #UFchat

1:29 am inkgypsy: #UFchat UF as mythicalization of mixed-race relationships + gremlin sex RT @Rarnabybudge @dknippling Blog-Urban Fantasy http://bit.ly/bmRxhE
1:38 am inkgypsy: #UFchat RT @ReneeRBA Love! RT @KMont New review An Artificial Night by @seananmcguire bk 3/series http://bit.ly/bPO4BO Awesome urban fantasy
1:43 am UF_Chat: #UFchat UF authors/writers must-read (chat topic soon) RT @Annemazer RT @ElizabethSCraig Top 10 urban fantasy pet peeves: http://dld.bz/rqwm
1:43 am inkgypsy: #UFchat UF authors/writers must-read (chat topic soon) RT @Annemazer RT @ElizabethSCraig Top 10 urban fantasy pet peeves: http://dld.bz/rqwm
1:48 am inkgypsy: Come discuss w author @Patti_OShea Aug 21 #UFchat Roots of PNR/UF RT @truthascension2: Tor.com post http://bit.ly/cgLZt5
2:00 am UF_Chat: UF writers alert: RT @katcop13: Urban fantasy #Flashfiction contest at Writtenwyrdd http://j.mp/ckBDxo #UFchat #fantasytalk #Flitchat
2:00 am inkgypsy: UF writers alert: RT @katcop13: Urban fantasy #Flashfiction contest at Writtenwyrdd http://j.mp/ckBDxo #UFchat #fantasytalk #Flitchat
2:06 am UF_Chat: #UFchat alert RT @orbitbooks: Kelley Armstrong on writing, her books and all things urban fantasy in this video Q&A http://ht.ly/2o4mR
2:06 am inkgypsy: #UFchat alert RT @orbitbooks: Kelley Armstrong on writing, her books and all things urban fantasy in this video Q&A http://ht.ly/2o4mR
2:09 am inkgypsy: Yep – I like Buffy. πŸ™‚ #UFchat RT @BuffyNews #buffy The Buffy Effect -The Rise of Urban Fantasy in Literature | Your .. http://bit.ly/95MB6x
2:12 am inkgypsy: @ShaeviStories I think that’s why many like UF – the funny/snark helps deal with the painful, while not ignoring it. πŸ™‚ #UFchat

inkgypsy: #UFchat RT @VampBookClub: As promised, Readers’ Top 10 Vampire Authors: http://ow.ly/2pvN5 #vampires

As always, if you want the group to be alerted to a UF topic, post or link, please use the #UFchat hashtag (I’m on here so many times because I’m retweeting things found and adding the hashtag).

See you at the next chat!

Gypsy (@inkgypsy)


Transcript for August 14th, 2010: The ‘Urban’ in Urban Fantasy

TOPIC: What’s the importance of the β€˜U’ in UF? What does β€˜urban’ mean to you?

AND Mapping UF

– the β€˜WHERE’s, the WHY of why writers choose to root their stories in a place & the IMPORTANCE of cities in UF.

I’m including an on-topic pre-chat conversation with Singaporean author @jolantru, who’s UF novel, based in Singapore, debuts in 2011. She had a lot of great things to say and I can’t wait to read her take on werewolves in Singapore.

I’ve added a color coding to aid in reading the topic/question and answer flow and to point out announcements and resources:

YELLOW = official #UFchat statement and questions to be discussed (I left the discussion additions the same as everyone else’s)

GREEN = #UFchat announcements

BLUE = resources (links, posts and essays relating to today’s topic)

Note: I have no idea what’s up with the date and times shown here! For reference, we started right at 3pmPST on Saturday August 14th.

2:56 am Cameron_Haley: RT @UF_Chat: Tomorrow = #UFchat day! 3pm PST/ 6pm EST TOPIC: Mapping UF -the ‘where’s, the why of locale choice & the importance of cities in UF. Pls RT
3:41 am inkgypsy: #UFchat RT @VampBookClub: As promised, Readers’ Top 10 Vampire Authors: http://ow.ly/2pvN5 #vampires
4:15 am scribe_solitary: RT @UF_Chat: Tomorrow = #UFchat day! 3pm PST/ 6pm EST TOPIC: Mapping UF -the ‘where’s, the why of locale choice & the importance of cities in UF. Pls RT
4:46 am jolantru: For the location of my UF novel, it is Singapore…my own country. #UFchat
4:56 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Would love to chat to you sometime about what you felt was important to include to make it ‘uniquely Singaporean’. #UFchat
5:00 am jolantru: @inkgypsy Lol. One day. I promise. Uniquely S’porean? Actually define ‘S’porean’. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
5:05 am LaylaMessner: RT @UF_Chat: Tomorrow #UFchat! 3pm PST/ 6pm EST TOPIC: Mapping UF -the ‘where’s, the why of locale choice & the importance of cities in UF.
5:08 am snowppl: Don’t forget @uf_chat hosts #ufchat TOMORROW (and every saturday) starting at 3pm PST/ 6 pm EST. Hope to see you there!
5:12 am inkgypsy: @jolantru I agree with understanding people & cultures but also how do U write ‘the city’ as opposed to Singa community for example? #UFchat
5:57 am jolantru: RT @inkgypsy: @jolantru I agree with understanding people & cultures but also how do U write ‘the city’ as opposed to Singa community for example? #UFchat
5:58 am inkgypsy: @jolantru One of the reasons I’m bringing up the topic is a ‘city’ is required for UF by definition but a criticism is that… #UFchat
6:00 am inkgypsy: @jolantru .. often only a token nod is given to the place (ie. it could really take place anywhere). Unless writer lives/is from… #UFchat
6:01 am inkgypsy: @jolantru .. there often nothing more than major landmarks are used that are very rarely integral to the story. #UFchat
6:02 am inkgypsy: @jolantru To my mind best stories ‘transplant’ you there so story can ONLY take place there. City affects person, just like in life. #UFchat
6:03 am jolantru: @inkgypsy True, true. I integrate the known landmarks but I weave in the nature too. #UFchat
6:03 am inkgypsy: @jolantru This is a bad example but Sue Grafton was rec’d to me when was living in Santa Barbara because she essentially wrote town #UFchat
6:04 am inkgypsy: @jolantru .. with diff names subbed. Tho wasn’t truly impressed I appreciated it more as could see the story in the streets/stores. #UFchat
6:04 am jolantru: @inkgypsy Yes! #UFchat
6:06 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Not sure it’s a conscious thing for many – but think stories would have more resonance if city was more solid (IMHO) #UFchat
6:07 am jolantru: @inkgypsy Mmm, suburban fantasy then? Singapore is very urban and I keep that in mind when I write. #UFchat
6:12 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Well, suburbs are city adjacent. LOL it’s the country town stuff that gets vague. Urban also implies grit & ‘streets’. #UFchat
6:13 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Genre ‘urban fiction’ implies a similar thing – grit, streets etc. In other words UF has to be more than contemp fantasy. #UFchat
6:15 am jolantru: @inkgypsy Yes. Street culture and subcultures. Ditto about the grit. #UFchat
6:16 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Kind of looks like you have a blog post already tweeted! LOL #UFchat πŸ˜€ Interesting subject tho – important I think.
6:24 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Here’s a question for you – what would you consider ‘grit’? πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
6:44 am jolantru: @inkgypsy Grit: dark, dealing with issues unflinchingly, dealing with the dark side of city life. #UFchat
6:46 am inkgypsy: @jolantru Agreed! Often people think pollution, cars, trash in streets, street gangs etc but I agree is more encompassing than that. #UFchat
8:02 am AnassaRh: @inkgypsy I keep meaning to tweet this to you for the @UF_chat list: http://twitter.com/#/list/UFW/urbanfantasywriters #ufchat
9:27 am UF_Chat: TOPIC for Aug 14th’s #UFchat expanded on the UFchat blog: http://bit.ly/atpevT Mapping UF: The importance of that ‘U’ in Urban Fantasy.
9:12 pm UF_Chat: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article City As Character by @Suzanne_Johnson http://bit.ly/9lQTlA #UFchat
9:12 pm inkgypsy: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article City As Character by @Suzanne_Johnson http://bit.ly/9lQTlA #UFchat
9:14 pm TENscribeshop: Yes, I’m excited about #UFChat today!
9:18 pm TENscribeshop: RT @inkgypsy: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article City As Character by @Suzanne_Johnson http://bit.ly/9lQTlA #UFchat
9:28 pm inkgypsy: Changing into my stomping boots & my not-so-secret #UFchat mod identity. Practicing my cab-calling whistle. Might need it in downtown-chat!
9:29 pm ShennandoahDiaz: RT @inkgypsy: Primer for #UFchat early birds: please take a look at article City As Character by @Suzanne_Johnson http://bit.ly/9lQTlA #UFchat
9:30 pm inkgypsy: ALERT! #UFchat starts in 1/2 hr! 3pm PST/6pm EST TODAY: Putting the ‘Urban’ in urban fantasy: city creatures, metro monsters & city centers.
9:30 pm UF_Chat: ALERT! #UFchat starts in 1/2 hr! 3pm PST/6pm EST TODAY: Putting the ‘Urban’ in urban fantasy: city creatures, metro monsters & city centers.
9:33 pm snowppl: @Shells2003 LOL! not quite, though I will be participating in #ufchat in about 30 minutes
9:35 pm jessrosenbooks: RT @inkgypsy: #UFchat starts in 1/2 hr! 3pm PST/6pm EST: Putting Urban in urban fantasy: city creatures, metro monsters & city centers.
9:40 pm VampBookClub: #UFChat is coming up in 20 minutes. Today we’re talking about the importance of the ‘U’ in UF.
9:45 pm UF_Chat: Countdown to #UFchat 15 mins to go! Get out your Google Maps! Today it’s cities in UF & the importance of the URBAN in UF (& metro monsters)
10:00 pm UF_Chat: 3, 2… and we are now live with #UFchat! Hope you have your boots on – we have a lot of ground to cover today! #UFchat
10:00 pm StephanieLMcGee: @inkgypsy Yes, I am! Finally! How many weeks and something always prevented me being here? #UFChat
10:01 pm UF_Chat: Today I will use ?Q:? for questions for discussion and ?S:? for statement tweets after which a ?Q:? (question) will follow. #UFchat
10:01 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: TODAY?S TOPIC: Mapping UF – the wheres, the why of locale-choice & the importance of cities in UF. #UFchat
10:01 pm Cameron_Haley: Hello again, everyone! #UFchat
10:01 pm StephanieLMcGee: Howdy everyone! #UFChat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: I’ll be posting questions every few minutes as we have lots of ground to cover (don’t worry – I have a map πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:02 pm snowppl: Hi everyone! #ufchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Hi! Welcome! Where are you basing your current UF? #UFchat
10:02 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat Locale- choice give the readers a point of reference for the story. We all know where SF or Chicago is so not much bkstory needed
10:02 pm UF_Chat: Q: What?s importance of the ?U? in UF? What does ?urban? mean to you? What makes it unique in contemp. fantasy? #UFchat
10:03 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat Well that’s good. I’d get lost without landmarks. #UFChat
10:03 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat I picked L.A. because one of the “mythologies” I wanted to play with was modern gang culture. #UFchat
10:03 pm Book_Faery: RT @UF_Chat: Q: What?s importance of the ?U? in UF? What does ?urban? mean to you? What makes it unique in contemp. fantasy? #UFchat
10:03 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Hello! #UFchat #UFchat
10:03 pm StephanieLMcGee: I think that, at least in part, the “urban” is to help keep the story grounded and from straying to the realm of sci-fi. #UFChat
10:04 pm JordanDrew: Hey y’all. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:04 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley That’s awesome – less based in LA than you’d think (maybe due to Buffy?) Interested to read that! #UFchat
10:04 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat Urban seems to be grittery. It’s not Suburban Fantasy #UFchat
10:04 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat the story can focus on the characters and plot rather than the setting
10:04 pm TENscribeshop: @Cameron_Haley This is a good example of how location can inform your story & how imp it can be #UFchat
10:04 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat Hello all
10:05 pm VampBookClub: The urban environment is what keeps the fantasy grounded, realistic and an additional element of danger #UFchat
10:05 pm StephanieLMcGee: Charlie Fletcher’s Stoneheart trilogy made the setting almost a character but still focused equally on plot/char and setting #UFChat
10:06 pm TENscribeshop: RT @VampBookClub: The urban environment is what keeps the fantasy grounded, realistic and an additional element of danger #UFchat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: I do think a bonus for writers in the UF genre is that people are interested to read how the cities will be used. #UFchat
10:06 pm Cameron_Haley: Plus, most people today live in urban environments, so they’re a natural setting for what are essentially modern folk/fairy tales. #UFchat
10:06 pm StephanieLMcGee: It’s true. Which is why they won’t enjoy my book. My “city” is outer space, but not sci-fi. Still total fantasy. #UFChat
10:07 pm StephanieLMcGee: I like the idea of urban adding more danger via @VampBookClub #UFChat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: @StephanieLMcGee that’s one of the separations between contemp fantasy and UF – contemp you can construct a completely new place. #UFchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: Q: Pub House definition of URBAN fantasy is that story must be based/include a developed ?real? city (ie. not be rural). Thoughts? #UFchat
10:09 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat, I mean, I still have my cities for parts of the book. But a lot of it is up in the stars. Tried to keep it grounded tho #UFChat
10:09 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley #UFchat Agree very much with modern folk/fairy tales – old grit brought to modern day.
10:09 pm UF_Chat: RT @Cameron_Haley: Plus, most people today live in urban environments, so they’re a natural setting for what are essentially modern folk/fairy tales. #UFchat
10:10 pm VampBookClub: The city as a character, another voice, can provides depth for both the novel and the characters within it. #UFchat
10:10 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat I think that there are varying degrees of inclusion. It can still be UF if it’s in a modern city, but city not nec. a char #UFChat
10:10 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat I agree with the view of modern day fairy tales.
10:10 pm UF_Chat: @VampBookClub Yes – in fact seen that used as part of definition for UF. City as character. #UFchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: RT @VampBookClub: The city as a character, another voice, can provides depth for both the novel and the characters within it. #UFchat
10:11 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat How far can a “real” city go, in terms of being different from reality, to still be considered #UFchat ?
10:11 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat It has other elements too. Categories = ways to sell #UFchat
10:11 pm Cameron_Haley: City as character…I think that’s one of our inheritances from the noir tradition. #UFchat
10:11 pm LaylaMessner: Just got here. So UF must include a real city? The Nocturn City novels by @caitkitt aren’t UF? Hmm. I had no idea. #UFChat
10:12 pm UF_Chat: @StephanieLMcGee That is true for the base definition yes – eg. Dresden Files use Chicago but not as a character. #UFchat
10:12 pm Cameron_Haley: UF cities can be fictional. #UFchat
10:13 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner She uses a city (we’ll be defining ‘city’ in just a bit), so @caitkitt definitely qualifies. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:13 pm johnnie_cakes: @UF_Chat The Sookie books are rural, and I think of them as Urban Fantasy #UFchat
10:13 pm cindymariej: I’ll be involved with #UFChat for the next hour or so @TENscribeshop account
10:13 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat Oh, I thought we were saying they had to be cities that actually exist in present day #UFChat
10:13 pm VampBookClub: RT @Cameron_Haley: City as character…I think thats one of our inheritances from the noir tradition. #UFchat
10:14 pm VampBookClub: @johnnie_cakes That’s a good point. I think of them as UF, too. #UFchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: @johnnie_cakes They are UF because they rely on Shreveport & use all the city constructs there to function. #UFchat
10:15 pm StephanieLMcGee: You have to go with the dicta of the story. If it calls for making up your own city in a real place, then do it. #UFChat
10:15 pm UF_Chat: RT @VampBookClub: RT @Cameron_Haley: City as character…I think thats one of our inheritances from the noir tradition. #UFchat
10:15 pm tasmin21: Hola, folks! Sorry I’m late! #UFChat
10:15 pm VampBookClub: @Cameron_Haley Agreed. Cities don’t need to be real — think @StaciaKane‘s Downside. #UFchat
10:15 pm UF_Chat: When stories are based in s smaller town it can get confusing – definitions coming in a bit to help with this. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:16 pm StephanieLMcGee: How do you deal with avoiding stereotypes short of being able to visit the city itself? Just curious. #UFChat
10:16 pm Cameron_Haley: @VampBookClub Or Raymond Chandler’s Bay City. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:16 pm smexybooks: Fun chat going on right now w/ hashtag #UFchat
10:16 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 *waves* Importance of cities in UF today. #UFchat
10:16 pm AuthorWilliam: Checking in late for #UFchat. What’s the topic today?
10:17 pm UF_Chat: @VampBookClub Actually @StaciaKane‘s cities ARE based in a real place – it’s just changed (she provides big hints in bks 2 & 3) #UFchat
10:17 pm TENscribeshop: @AuthorWilliam Role of U in UF #UFchat
10:17 pm UF_Chat: Q: What cities are you aware of that have been used in UF novels? #UFchat
10:17 pm tasmin21: Was thinking about this today, re: my own book. The city itself is a rather minor part, it’s just setting. #UFChat
10:17 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee google maps! #UFChat
10:17 pm tasmin21: My sequels will be in other places, too. So how much leeway? #UFChat
10:18 pm StephanieLMcGee: London and New York. But NY seems especially popular. #UFChat
10:18 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam The importance of cities in UF. From the ‘noir heritage’ of city as character to real-based worlds. #UFchat
10:18 pm VampBookClub: @UF_Chat Yes, she based them off a real city, but the actual ‘Triumph City’ isn’t real. #UFchat
10:18 pm Cameron_Haley: @tasmin21 A DEVIL IN THE DETAILS is almost suburban fantasy, which is a refreshing change. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:18 pm tasmin21: Mine is set in Kansas City. #UFChat
10:18 pm johnnie_cakes: @UF_Chat true, but if it’s city as character, most of the character in the books comes from Bon Temps, not Shreveport #UFchat
10:18 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl But what about for character, locations within the city, culture? Maps are great for direction but need more. #UFChat
10:18 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 There is a huge variety of how cities are used but in yours we couldn’t have had your ‘weather’ without the location set. #UFchat
10:18 pm tasmin21: @Cameron_Haley Woo! Always wanted to be my own genre. πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:19 pm VampBookClub: Re: common cities in UF. NYC, Chicago, London #UFchat
10:19 pm LaylaMessner: What about our world later (i.e. in “public” worlds) RT @UF_Chat: Yes – can be fictional but has to still be in OURworld #UFChat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: @leatherzebra Depends on reader – I know I’ve discovered books simply because wanted to see if a UF written there. #UFchat
10:19 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat Very true, didn’t think of that. #UFChat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: He he – better get to that city definition quick I see! LOL #UFchat
10:19 pm Cameron_Haley: Atlanta, Cincinatti, San Francisco, Chicago… #UFchat
10:20 pm TENscribeshop: Q-is it more common to name the city or to just let the description and feel of city tell audience where it is set #UFChat
10:20 pm tasmin21: Isn’t there a series set in Toronto? #UFChat
10:20 pm UF_Chat: S: K.Harrison chose alt Cincinnati for Hollows series not just b/cause knew from child also distance from salt water (breaks spells) #UFchat
10:20 pm StephanieLMcGee: @TENscribeshop I named my cities, just to keep the reader oriented because the characters moved a couple of times and traveled. #UFChat
10:20 pm leatherzebra: @UF_Chat Do you think there’s a draw then for people to write in certain cities to draw that “local” factor? #UFchat
10:21 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee often a visit is good. or knowing people there. Most places do have a distinct feel. Write what you know πŸ™‚ #UFChat
10:21 pm UF_Chat: Q: Why do you think authors chose places they did? What do you think attraction was to set a UF series there? #UFchat
10:21 pm Cameron_Haley: New Orleans, obviously…any UF set in Miami? That would be a great setting. #UFchat
10:21 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 That sounds familiar but I can’t think which right now… #UFchat
10:21 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: K.Harrison chose alt Cincinnati for Hollows series not just b/c knew it also distance from salt water (breaks spells) #UFchat
10:21 pm AuthorWilliam: @Cameron_Haley Hm..that might more appropriate for #SUFchat #ufchat πŸ™‚
10:21 pm leatherzebra: @UF_Chat Also, can you have UF style but not urban, like Ilona Andrews’ On The Edge? #UFchat
10:21 pm Shells2003: #UFchat can’t you just make your own city up? Its fantasy right? Get a little creative?
10:22 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl But write what I know is so boring. SLC is not a thrilling place. #UFChat
10:22 pm tasmin21: I chose KC partly because I know it (live here) and partly as homage to Jim Butcher who wasn’t allowed to put the Dresden files here #UFChat
10:22 pm Cameron_Haley: I think Kelley Armstrong’s “Bitten” and maybe some others are in Toronto. #UFchat
10:23 pm StephanieLMcGee: I chose the cities I did b/c of what’s there. NASA. And AF bases. The research was fun for it all. #UFChat
10:23 pm leatherzebra: @UF_Chat I’m working on an UF based in Louisville as well #UFchat
10:23 pm DEcharacters: @StephanieLMcGee I think SLC can be fun. It’s diverse, has different clubs, and with the right characters/plot then it would work #UFchat
10:23 pm UF_Chat: @Shells2003 It’s one of the defining lines b/w contemp fantasy & UF fantasy – can make up a city but still must ‘exist’ in our world #UFchat
10:23 pm TENscribeshop: @StephanieLMcGee Are they real cities ? #UFChat
10:23 pm StephanieLMcGee: @DEcharacters SLC is like the least diverse place in the world. #UFChat
10:24 pm StephanieLMcGee: @TENscribeshop Yep. San Antonio, Houston, Cape Canaveral. #UFChat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: @Shells2003 Eg C. Harris’s Sookie series has false small town but near (& reliant on) the very real Shreveport. #UFchat
10:24 pm TENscribeshop: @Shells2003 It’s one of the defining lines b/w contemp fantasy & UF fantasy – can make up a city but still must ‘exist’ in our world #UFchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: S: A rare criticism of Jim Butcher?s Dresden Files is stories don?t consistently feel rooted in Chicago. Some stories yes, some no. #UFchat
10:24 pm leatherzebra: @UF_Chat I think the city factor comes because UF is about PEOPLE, how they react to the injection of paranormal… #UFchat
10:24 pm Book_Faery: @Shells2003 It’s fun being able to experience a new city you’ve never been to when the author makes the city more of a “character” #ufchat
10:24 pm tasmin21: I’ve got another one in the works, set in San Diego ’cause I needed the ocean, and preferably a military presence. #UFChat
10:25 pm leatherzebra: @UF_Chat …and you find more people and more KINDS of people in cities, thus a richer story. #UFchat
10:25 pm DEcharacters: @StephanieLMcGee i dunno, compared to even Ogden, or Provo, it is diverse. More religions, orientations, businesses, etc #UFchat
10:25 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat He’d never been to Chicago until Book 8! All things considered, not too shabby. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:26 pm bettyviolablue: Mine’s set in St. Petersburg, Russia, but has much worldbuilding involved for the additional settings of Heaven and Hell. Still UF? #UFchat
10:26 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee SLC? OMG Of course it is. Most people don’t think of ‘home’ as exotic. Just think of those that DON’T live there #UFChat
10:26 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 oh – nice! San Diego desperately needs one! Lots of uniqueness to that place. #UFchat
10:26 pm StephanieLMcGee: re: authenticity London. But that may be b/c I spent 2 months there on a study abroad so could picture it. #UFChat
10:26 pm DEcharacters: @StephanieLMcGee plus, imagine how the Church and some of the locations, Temple Square, would deal with Paranormal #UFchat
10:27 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat London in @caitkitt‘s Black Lonson series. re: Authentic feeling (but I’ve never been to London, so… ;)) #UFChat
10:27 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Not about shabby – not all complain either. But since criticism brought up ? is how might he have better integrated? #UFchat
10:27 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl Do you know how rare it is in SLC/UT to see any sort of ethnic minority on a routine basis? #UFChat
10:27 pm Cameron_Haley: @bettyviolablue St. Petersburg definitely counts! The NIGHT WATCH books are great UF, set in Moscow. #UFchat
10:27 pm StephanieLMcGee: @DEcharacters Now, that could be interesting. You should write it. #UFChat
10:28 pm TENscribeshop: @bettyviolablue Good question. If some settings are real cities but others aren’t, still… #UFchat ?
10:28 pm UF_Chat: RT @snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee SLC? OMG Of course it is. Most people don’t think of ‘home’ as exotic. Just think of those that DON’T live there #UFChat
10:28 pm StephanieLMcGee: The 39 Clues books often, IMO, struggle with the authenticity factor. I struggle sometimes getting a sense of location. #UFChat
10:28 pm DEcharacters: @StephanieLMcGee lol. I’ll add it to my 50+ novel ideas. Sounds fun to me #UFchat
10:28 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Probably would have helped if he’d had Google Earth when he started. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:28 pm UF_Chat: S: @jolantru?s UF novel debuting 2011 takes place in Singapore (?Wolf at the Door?) – a 1st for the city/country. #UFchat
10:28 pm UF_Chat: Q: What cities would you LIKE to see UF novel take place in? Is there something a city should have to qualify as a good UF location? #UFchat
10:29 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Yes – esp now you have the images available! (less in air fares πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:29 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee Same as rural new england? probably more minorites in SLC. πŸ˜› #UFChat
10:29 pm StephanieLMcGee: I’d love to see some of the less touristy cities of like Hawaii, and Europe. Dig deeper into surrounding culture. #UFChat
10:29 pm bettyviolablue: @Cameron_Haley It’s the epic fantasy-style Heaven and Hell that makes me hesitate to call it UF. I think it is, but agents may not. #UFchat
10:30 pm VampBookClub: @Cameron_Haley @UF_Chat The real question: How much has Google Earth helped UF writers? lol #UFchat
10:30 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl SLC is something like the 2nd least diverse city in the country. Or so I may have heard. #UFChat
10:30 pm bettyviolablue: @Cameron_Haley BTW, loved Night Watch/Day Watch movies…haven’t read books yet. Are they available in English? #UFchat
10:31 pm tasmin21: @StephanieLMcGee Oooh, Hawaii could be really cool. Lots of mythology and culture to work with there. #UFChat
10:31 pm Cameron_Haley: I’d definitely love to see more international cities — Tokyo, Hong Kong, Rome, Rio, Johannesburg…so many wonderful places! #UFchat
10:31 pm StephanieLMcGee: @tasmin21 I know, right? So would New Zealand and Australia, with the Maori and Aboriginal cultures. #UFChat
10:31 pm LaylaMessner: I agree re: Hawaii #UFChat
10:31 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat Albuquerque or Santa Fe #UFchat
10:32 pm UF_Chat: @bettyviolablue Have you read Ekaterina Sedia’s Moscow book? It’s excellent & UF tho differnt to usual kickass/leather. Recommended! #UFchat
10:32 pm StephanieLMcGee: @Cameron_Haley Oooh, Rome. Would adore to read something set there that isn’t Dan Brown. #UFChat
10:32 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee lol diversity is important IRL, but for books, it’s a little less so #UFChat
10:32 pm UF_Chat: I hope UF authors are watching – a ton if ideas happening on #UFchat right now for what people want to read! #UFchat
10:32 pm snowppl: BTW, I should introduce myself. πŸ™‚ I’m a co-mod for #ufchat. More behind the scenes.
10:33 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl I guess. I do still think it would be nice to diversify in a real way so that readers’ world-views are broadened. #UFChat
10:33 pm TENscribeshop: RT @Cameron_Haley: I’d definitely love to see more international cities — Tokyo, Hong Kong, Rome, Rio, Johannesburg #UFchat
10:33 pm bettyviolablue: @UF_Chat No, I haven’t. Looks like I have some books to read. #loverussia πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:33 pm AuthorWilliam: @snowppl Ahhh a little southwestern setting, I like! #ufchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: Q: Back to basics then: what is ?a city? to you? Is it the landmarks? The types of people? The language? What? #UFchat
10:34 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl Navajo culture is so intriguing. Think of all the uses for turquoise in a good UF. #UFChat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: S: Urban, according to Dictionary.com, means “of, pertaining to, or designating a city or town.” #UFchat
10:34 pm Amy_tilberg: Hello, all πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: S: ?City? def: A permnt cntr of popul, commerce & culture; town of significant size & importance (USA= 2, 500+) http://bit.ly/3hXGpA #UFchat
10:34 pm Cameron_Haley: I think diversity is hugely important in UF…otherwise, we get the same cultural traditions and context repeated over and over. #UFchat
10:35 pm UF_Chat: S: Don?t need capital city for UF. @jsmithready?s WVMP Radio bks based in Sherwood, Maryland. Sml but meets US city requirements. #UFchat
10:35 pm StephanieLMcGee: City, to me, is a place that has more than just the local bowling lane (to call a stereotype). Culture, theater, underground, etc #UFChat
10:35 pm tasmin21: A city has to encompass all those things. Even in real life, cities have personalities, and it’s due to its people & their cultures #UFChat
10:35 pm UF_Chat: @Amy_tilberg Hi! Welcome – talking about importance of cities in UF today. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:35 pm anilumagloire: RT @VampBookClub: Re: common cities in UF. NYC, Chicago, London #UFchat >>. Where is Downside located in the US?
10:35 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat I place with more people than a town ;). I’d heard somewhere it was defined as having a pop. over 10K #UFChat
10:36 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat the landmarks, the general feel of the place. DC feels incredibly differently than LA, than NYC #UFchat
10:36 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @DEcharacters: I consider city as large population, business areas almost pushed together, dense but large spread without tons of space between #UFchat
10:36 pm Amy_tilberg: @UF_Chat Ooh thank you πŸ™‚ I had just asked someone what the topic was πŸ˜€ #UFchat
10:36 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee well you can always miff a little bit too. It is fiction after all πŸ™‚ #UFChat
10:36 pm snowppl: @AuthorWilliam yes. very beautiful too #ufchat
10:36 pm StephanieLMcGee: Heck, if a place has more than one bookstore chain I’ll call it a city. #UFChat
10:36 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee yes. although there are tons of native cultures in that area as well #UFChat
10:37 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat I’ll check it out. #UFChat
10:37 pm JordanDrew: lol RT @StephanieLMcGee: Heck, if a place has more than one bookstore chain Ill call it a city. #ufchat
10:37 pm TENscribeshop: RT @StephanieLMcGee: Heck, if a place has more than one bookstore chain I’ll call it a city. #UFChat
10:37 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl Very true. Hopi and Zuni at the very least. And kachina dolls and zuni fetishes could be good elements for fantasy/UF #UFChat
10:38 pm UF_Chat: @StephanieLMcGee LOL! (Actually I think just having one technically qualifies πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:38 pm StephanieLMcGee: @JordanDrew @TENscribeshop What can I say? I like my freedom of choice. #UFChat
10:38 pm LaylaMessner: Grit: I think it has to do with the knowledge that the world is not simple and clean and easy, not black and white #UFChat
10:38 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Dangerous, low-income but mansions on the outside of the city #UFchat
10:39 pm Cameron_Haley: Grit: For me, it’s back to noir tradition’s emphasis on cynicism, corruption, decay, morality that’s shades of gray. #UFchat
10:39 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee darn it! i now have to write UF in NM. Had to open my mouth didn’t i? :-\ #UFChat
10:40 pm StephanieLMcGee: @snowppl LOL I like NM. My dad grew up there. #UFChat
10:40 pm tasmin21: Ditto @Cameron_Haley. It’s the darkness that lurks under every soccer mom’s bright smile. πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:40 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley NOIR! (Just had to shout that – love that UF has that ‘heritage’ as you called it – grit, snark, city-charac. etc) #UFchat
10:40 pm LaylaMessner: Heck yeah! RT @Cameron_Haley. Its the darkness that lurks under every soccer moms bright smile. πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:40 pm UF_Chat: RT @tasmin21: Ditto @Cameron_Haley. It’s the darkness that lurks under every soccer mom’s bright smile. πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:41 pm snowppl: @StephanieLMcGee I lived there for about 2.5 years. OMG so pretty! #UFChat
10:41 pm Cameron_Haley: Nice ! RT @tasmin21: Ditto @Cameron_Haley. Its the darkness that lurks under every soccer moms bright smile. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:41 pm braedenwolf: Grit to me is the dark future as typified by Bladerunner #UFChat
10:41 pm tasmin21: Just realized how creepy that sounded. #UFChat
10:41 pm Cameron_Haley: @tasmin21 Hope you wrote that line down…cause we all did. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:42 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat lol yes, the underside. not the privileged suburbans. tho I think suburbia is scary. #UFchat
10:42 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat I think it comes to just grounding the story. Location descriptions, out enjoying the city with danger lurking. #UFChat
10:42 pm UF_Chat: @braedenwolf The grit question relates to the genre of urban fiction – which is contemp inner city fiction. Also very dark. #UFchat
10:43 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat How people actually go about their day and how they deal with things, keep emotins rooted too #UFchat
10:43 pm AuthorWilliam: @snowppl Suburbia IS scary. lol #ufchat
10:43 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat I think it’s just remembering your characters don’t operate in a vacuum. They will affect things, and be affected by them. #UFChat
10:43 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat I think the locations you use need to be able to exist in the city you use, though they may or may not #UFChat
10:43 pm TENscribeshop: Quoting @braedenwolf : “Urban fiction …is contemporary inner city fiction” #UFchat
10:44 pm snowppl: @AuthorWilliam whew. I’m glad I’m not the only one. #ufchat
10:44 pm UF_Chat: @snowppl Yep – suburbia can be it’s own kind of scary. I swear we’re totally waiting for a zombie invasion where we are! #UFchat
10:44 pm VampBookClub: RT @tasmin21: I think its just remembering your characters dont operate in a vacuum. They will affect things, be affected by them. #UFchat
10:44 pm LaylaMessner: I def don’t think it has to be inner city RT @TENscribeshop @braedenwolf : “Urban fiction …is contemporary inner city fiction” #UFChat
10:45 pm StephanieLMcGee: I think you can inject fear into any setting, if done well. City where I grew up actually had more gangs than the inner-city. #UFChat
10:45 pm UF_Chat: RT @tasmin21: @UF_Chat I think it’s just remembering your characters don’t operate in a vacuum. They will affect things, and be affected by them. #UFChat
10:45 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat One way to integrate the “urban” is to flavor the story with a particularly flavorful part of the chosen city. #ufchat
10:45 pm StephanieLMcGee: But you wouldn’t know it, b/c they’re more subversive, more hidden. But still a very real threat. #UFChat
10:46 pm Cameron_Haley: I think you can definitely keep those urban themes (NOIR!) whether your world is open or closed, real city or fictional. #UFchat
10:46 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat ack! quick! get the guns and explosives! #UFchat
10:46 pm LaylaMessner: RT @AuthorWilliam One way to integrate the “urban” is to flavor the story with a particularly flavorful part of the chosen city. #UFChat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner That’s the genre of urban FICTION as opposed to urban FANTASY – easy to get mixed up with that. #UFchat
10:47 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat Oh, got it. #UFChat
10:47 pm tasmin21: In open worlds,there will be new “rules”, therefore there must be new ways to break those rules. A new underbelly, different grit. #UFChat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: @snowppl No kidding. They’ve even officially named this city ‘Awesome Town’ – how can we NOT have an invasion?! Arghh! LOL #UFchat
10:48 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat really? REALLY? Run for your life! #UFchat
10:48 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat Maybe UF takes that inner city feel, embodied often in paranormal/other fantasy elements and spreads it wherever #UFChat
10:48 pm UF_Chat: Q: In same vein – how are creatures/monsters affected by city locations as well as the people? Eg easy to see how vamps like cities #UFchat
10:48 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat LOL @snowppl No kidding. They’ve even officially named this city ‘Awesome Town’- how can we not have an invasion?!… #UFChat
10:48 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat “Awesometown”??? #ufchat πŸ˜€
10:49 pm bettyviolablue: Joined #UFChat for the first time and have to run already. Thanks everyone! Hope to be at the next one.
10:49 pm StephanieLMcGee: I just read “City of Bones” by Cassandra Clare and one group is there b/c the other is drawn to the populous city. #UFChat
10:49 pm LaylaMessner: Sounds like the title of a UF novel…with a really creep cover. RT @AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat “Awesometown”??? #ufchat πŸ˜€ #UFChat
10:49 pm TENscribeshop: I definitely think it’s more the emotion of inner city lies beneath urban, than the real location @LaylaMessner @UF_Chat #UFChat
10:49 pm Cameron_Haley: @tasmin21 Right on. For example, in Mark del Franco’s Connor Grey series, there’s a Boston ghetto filled with faerie prostitutes… #UFchat
10:50 pm UF_Chat: Q: What are good tools for building authenticity of ?place? in writing UF? Eg what would be a good way to use Google Maps? #UFchat
10:50 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat Enjoy your Saturday! #UFChat
10:50 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat ah! i see. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:50 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat It’s easier to hide in a city and find ways to blend in, if you have any sort of human form #UFchat
10:50 pm tasmin21: @Cameron_Haley Exactly! In my in-progress one, there’s an entire drug industry aimed at the supers, not the humans. #UFChat
10:50 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat If the creatures blend in, there are some cities where they could be more out in the open. Also depends on creatures’ vibe #ufchat
10:50 pm LaylaMessner: RT @TENscribeshop: I definitely think its more the emotion of inner city lies beneath urban, than the real location #UFChat
10:51 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner OK you outed me – except it’s not fantasy anymore, it’s an autobiography! (groans) #UFchat
10:51 pm StephanieLMcGee: @UF_Chat re: bldg auth. If you need that little telling detail. Like in the space of a block there being 10-12 “No u-turn” signs. #UFChat
10:51 pm TENscribeshop: @Cameron_Haley @tasmin21 I’m from Boston – that sounds pretty accurate. #UFchat
10:51 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat And some creatures, by nature, just won’t do well in cities. Can be good conflict, if they’re forced there. #UFChat
10:51 pm LaylaMessner: RT @TENscribeshop Its easier to hide in a city and find ways to blend in, if you have any sort of human form #UFChat
10:52 pm DEcharacters: I’ve never actually used google maps for writing, then again I don’t often write UF #UFchat
10:52 pm Cameron_Haley: @TENscribeshop Okay, I did spell it “faerie” lol #UFchat
10:52 pm Amy_tilberg: I have a question, Is it OK to create your own city for an UF? #UFchat
10:52 pm LaylaMessner: Haha RT @UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner OK you outed me – except its not fantasy anymore, its an autobiography! (groans) #UFChat
10:52 pm snowppl: Idk if I like dealing with creatures in UF. Sometimes it’s just fun to have magic in cities. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:52 pm StephanieLMcGee: RT @TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Its easier to hide in a city and find ways to blend in, if you have any sort of human form #UFChat
10:52 pm VampBookClub: RT @TENscribeshop Its easier to hide in a city and find ways to blend in, if you have any sort of human form #UFchat
10:53 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 Yes -don’t see that much. I’d like to see that tension a bit more. (Not all people do well in cities either.) #UFchat
10:53 pm LaylaMessner: Maybe for “monsters” it’s like for gay people -like to live in cities cause more diverse and open minded, easier to find your tribe #UFChat
10:53 pm UF_Chat: Q: What cities would be a big challenge to write for UF? eg New Orleans Why? (See resources at chat-end for NO article) #UFchat
10:54 pm LaylaMessner: (I can say that because I’m gay) #UFChat
10:54 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat definite knowledge of the place. google maps often has pictures that help give a sense of place #UFchat
10:54 pm snowppl: @UF_Chat and of course there is street view! #UFchat
10:54 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat Now thinking monster that migrates to breed ever 200 years, only now there’s a city in the way. What happens? #UFChat
10:54 pm Cameron_Haley: Cities are like the watering hole on the savanna…lots of food! #UFchat
10:54 pm StephanieLMcGee: Re: difficult cities I think NYC b/c so many are there. How to make it unique? Any major city, IMO would be difficult. #UFChat
10:55 pm LaylaMessner: Street view rocks RT @snowppl: @UF_Chat and of course there is street view! #UFChat
10:55 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner I think it’s true for any of us who feel ‘different’ as in ‘not part of the mainstream’. Cities can help. #UFchat
10:56 pm UF_Chat: S: UF can be modern or historical though UF-as-genre (pub def.) tends to be contemporary. Yet not all contemp. fantasy is UF. #UFchat
10:56 pm LaylaMessner: Yes RT @UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner I think its true for any of us who feel different as in not part of the mainstream. Cities can help. #UFChat
10:56 pm AuthorWilliam: I think Tucson would be an interesting city to set a UF story in. #ufchat
10:56 pm StephanieLMcGee: They don’t need me at work so I can stick around for longer. Yay! #UFChat
10:56 pm snowppl: @LaylaMessner yay! #amgaytoo #UFChat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: Q: (Last big one): What?s the difference between contemporary fantasy that mentions a city and UF? #UFchat
10:57 pm TENscribeshop: LA would be a difficult city because of its extreme diversity. Every corner speaks a different language. #UFChat
10:57 pm StephanieLMcGee: @AuthorWilliam Definitely. #UFChat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: RT @Cameron_Haley: Cities are like the watering hole on the savanna…lots of food! #UFchat
10:57 pm LaylaMessner: yay! and I like that #tag RT @snowppl: yay! #amgaytoo #UFChat
10:58 pm AuthorWilliam: I think Halifax, NS might be challenging for UF, it seemed too pristine when I visited. Great for other types of stories tho. #ufchat
10:58 pm LaylaMessner: Good Q RT @UF_Chat: Q: (Last big one): What?s the difference between contemporary fantasy that mentions a city and UF? #UFChat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: @TENscribeshop Wondering if that’s the reason Buffy was set in a suburb – LA proper is so diverse. Difficult to pin down accurately #UFchat
10:59 pm StephanieLMcGee: @AuthorWilliam But think about how much fun you could have turning the city on its head and making it gritty! #UFChat
10:59 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Can you chime in on UF-ing LA? Did you find it difficult to pin down due to big extremes (incl entertainment)? #UFchat
10:59 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Q: (Last big one): What?s the difference between contemporary fantasy that mentions a city and UF? #UFchat
11:00 pm snowppl: @AuthorWilliam ooh but pristine can mean = hidden underside #ufchat
11:00 pm StephanieLMcGee: RE: diff b/t UF and contemp, I’m not one to speak. Still a newbie to this whole genre. Used to high fantasy. #UFChat
11:00 pm AuthorWilliam: @StephanieLMcGee True! #ufchat I have every intention of setting a story there. It had a lasting impact on me. Not sure it’ll be UF tho.
11:01 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat I love that diversity. The heroine is multicultural (Mexican-Irish), I’ve got Chinese, Korean, Somali, Russian chars… #UFchat
11:01 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Yes, nearly every block here is a prime location. Suburbs are all pretty similar on the surface #UFchat
11:01 pm LaylaMessner: Okay, laptop battery dying and dog attacking couch = time to run. Thanks for a great #UFChat
11:01 pm AuthorWilliam: @snowppl True…hmm…Perhaps this means Disney should consider setting its next squeaky clean musical in Detroit… #ufchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: @snowppl Yes – pristine mean. Look at the clubs and the rich elite for an extreme example. Corruption not far from privilege. #UFchat
11:02 pm StephanieLMcGee: RE: diversity, I think it’s hugely important and yet I botched it in my current project. (Racism a huge sub-plot/pt. of char. arc.) #UFChat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: @Cameron_Haley Agree loving diversity. (Am also writing an LA-based UF -much easier now am living here tho) #UFchat
11:03 pm StephanieLMcGee: I should say, overcoming racism is a huge part of it. Not the act itself. #UFChat
11:03 pm snowppl: @AuthorWilliam LOL! #ufchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: That hour went quickly! That?s a wrap for #UFchat today! Resources & announcements for the week being tweeted next. #UFchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: Announcement: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFchat
11:03 pm Cameron_Haley: @UF_Chat Definitely — I lived there for a year, and even that was a big help. #UFchat
11:04 pm StephanieLMcGee: Thanks, everyone! This was fun. See you in a couple weeks. (I work next Sat. so have to miss. 😦 ) #UFChat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: Upcoming TOPIC: UF – The Good, the Bad & the Untapped: Urban Fantasy Pet Peeves & Wish Lists – what readers REALLY want (now). #UFchat
11:04 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Wow! That did go quickly. Thanks everyone. I would love suggestions for other chats #UFchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: Also aiming to add new weekly post to #UFchat blog just before or just after Sat: ?UF Related Links & Tweets This Week? #UFchat
11:04 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat LA is a great city for UF. #ufchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: No new releases found for the week of August 8th to 14th by UF authors on Twitter. (If know of one, please @inkgypsy) #UFchat
11:05 pm TENscribeshop: @UF_Chat Getting that article to rea dahead of time was very helpful, thank you. #UFchat
11:05 pm snowppl: That was a great chat! Now I think I have to make dinner. πŸ™‚ #ufchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Yes – this one is proving a ton of fun to write. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:06 pm StephanieLMcGee: RT @UF_Chat: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFChat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: Some UF resources on today?s topic (the URBAN of urban fantasy) for writers & readers in the next few tweets: #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: City As Character by @Suzanne_Johnson for the Tor blog during Urban Fantasy focus month. http://bit.ly/9lQTlA #UFchat
11:06 pm tasmin21: Thanks for the chat guys! Back to work for me. #UFChat
11:06 pm Cameron_Haley: Thanks, all. See you next week! #UFchat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: @TENscribeshop No worries! I’ll try to put up an early bird primer every week now. #UFchat
11:07 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 Thanks! Awesome input. Looking forward to next book in series and next place too. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:07 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:07 pm TENscribeshop: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:07 pm UF_Chat: What Urban Fantasy Means To Me by @SusanSizemore (For Tor blog) The real world with the weird. http://bit.ly/ab1dN4 #UFchat
11:07 pm AuthorWilliam: Great chat, wish I could have been present for the whole thing. Another great topic today! Love talking urban settings. #ufchat
11:07 pm UF_Chat: The Urban Fantasy Community (with excellent definitions) on Facebook http://bit.ly/cpFNyP #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: [Don’t fully agree but good food for thought]: Urban Fantasy Always Takes Place in Alternate Worlds http://bit.ly/biOzuX #UFchat
11:08 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Thanks for stopping by – you can catch up with the transcript. πŸ™‚ Up in 36 hrs to allow for late comment-inclusion. #UFchat
11:09 pm TENscribeshop: RT @UF_Chat: The Urban Fantasy Community (with excellent definitions) on Facebook http://bit.ly/cpFNyP #UFchat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: Paper Cities antho edited by Ekaterina Sedia was attempt to bring ?urban? back to UF with interesting results. http://bit.ly/bGp7CU #UFchat
11:09 pm UF_Chat: Reminder: UF writers announcement: Sheep & Wolves contest http://bit.ly/bx23QLUFchat Write traditional monster from new perspective. #
11:09 pm UF_Chat: We are slowly making a list of UF authors on Twitter on #UFchat blog site. Please suggest more by @-ing @inkgypsy or @snowppl #UFchat
11:10 pm UF_Chat: @UF_Chat going dark. πŸ˜‰ Transcript will be available on the #UFchat blog in 36hrs-ish, allowing for late comments to be added. #UFchat
11:11 pm monstermax3: RT @VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:11 pm UF_Chat: Thanks to everyone today! Awesome chat, input and ideas for all busy writing UF. See you all next week for our special author Q&A! #UFchat
11:11 pm VampBookClub: Authors: #UFchat is making a list of UF authors on Twittter. Hit up @inkgypsy if you’d like to be included.
11:14 pm UF_Chat: RT @VampBookClub: Authors: #UFchat is making a list of UF authors on Twittter. Hit up @inkgypsy if you’d like to be included.
11:14 pm inkgypsy: RT @VampBookClub: Authors: #UFchat is making a list of UF authors on Twittter. Hit up @inkgypsy if you’d like to be included.
11:15 pm inkgypsy: Wow – that hour really flew in #UFchat today – a ton of excellent resources and ideas. Wanna write UF? Check out today’s chat for ton ideas!
11:15 pm jimnduncan: Aw rats, missed #ufchat this week.
11:16 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat Always a pleasure. I love talking genre. It’s not such a study of marketing trends but of how we express ourselves as well. #ufchat
11:19 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Thanks! And agreed. Think people are drawn to genres for a reason – not (just) about popcorn. πŸ˜‰ #Ufchat
11:23 pm shadowflame1974: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:25 pm jimnduncan: RT @VampBookClub Late reply but think UF has a darker, dirtier, more violent tone to it than contemp. fant. bit of a generalization #ufchat
11:26 pm shadowflame1974: #UFchat thanks for the discussion.
11:31 pm luvreading05: RT @VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PNR overlap ? August 21st! {NEXT WEEK!] #UFchat
11:36 pm rixshep: Late comment rt @UF_Chat @Cameron_Haley: Cities like watering hole on savanna, lots of food! #UFchat / As in “prey” for nonhumans!
11:36 pm inkgypsy: @jimnduncan The noir roots of UF have actually added a few things… going to be bigger topic than people realize. #UFchat
11:47 pm JennCNTaylor: RT @VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat: K.Harrison chose alt Cincinnati for Hollows series not just b/c knew it also distance from salt water (breaks spells) #UFchat
August 15, 2010
12:02 am inkgypsy: @tadbo Aiming for before midnight Sunday night. πŸ™‚ Or you can look up the #UFchat hashtag right now. πŸ™‚
12:13 am inkgypsy: @JulieeJohnsonn Blogging for fairy tales only – plus big #UFchat prep (that went very well today). Plus a little more WIP writing. πŸ™‚
12:33 am JulieeJohnsonn: @inkgypsy very happy about #UFchat if only to get great book ideas 4 reading! its quick becoming my fav genre…gravitating to it like crazy
1:16 am ThunderBirdsDie: RT @VampBookClub: RT @tasmin21: I think its just remembering your characters dont operate in a vacuum. They will affect things, be affected by them. #UFchat
6:34 am jolantru: RT @UF_Chat: S: @jolantru?s UF novel debuting 2011 takes place in Singapore (?Wolf at the Door?) – a 1st for the city/country. #UFchat
6:59 am HereBeGeeks: RT @UF_Chat: S: @jolantru?s UF novel debuting 2011 takes place in Singapore (?Wolf at the Door?) – a 1st for the city/country. #UFchat
7:37 am AnassaRh: Timelineing another novel-day (or two), then rewarding myself with #ufchat.
8:36 am AnassaRh: Urban: set in city. Should feel like chosen city, but grit isn’t a must. Possible to live in city + only /glimpse/ underbelly. #ufchat
8:39 am AnassaRh: I’m with those saying “urban” important because gives reference points. Also, it sets the mood and expectations for the reader. #ufchat
8:41 am AnassaRh: I will expect a different experience from LA UF, NYC UF, and London UF. May even choose new reads based on city. #ufchat
8:43 am AnassaRh: Agree RT@StephanieLMcGee: I think thr R varying degrees of inclusion. It cn still B UF if in a modern city, but city not nec. a char #UFChat
8:49 am AnassaRh: I’d like more UF in the Sookie vein: town/city too small for skyscrapers, surrounded by rural areas, small-town feel. #UFChat
8:53 am AnassaRh: The Big City might be glamorous, but it’s not the only kind. Lots of places make “city” population cut but lack glitz. Grew up in 1. #UFChat
9:01 am AnassaRh: Cities used: London, Seattle, Chicago, Boston, Atlanta, Denver, Cincinatti, Toronto, Vancouver, NYC, San Francisco, Portland. #UFChat
9:03 am AnassaRh: Lillith St. Crow has series in?New Mexico? Didn’t catch city name.Don’t know enough US geog. to know if D. Rowland’s Beaulac is real #UFChat
9:04 am AnassaRh: And yes, I did just use a “have read” list for reference. #UFChat
9:09 am AnassaRh: Benefit/Detractor? Usu benefit 4 me as book feels authentic, but don’t want location-dropping or only local knowledge. @leatherzebra #UFChat
9:11 am AnassaRh: I like a range: mention the Eiffel Tower + Notre Dame, but also that perfect little bistro + the obscure plaza. @leatherzebra #UFChat
9:17 am AnassaRh: @StephanieLMcGee For culture, etc. I’d read books, articles, blogs by locals. And nearly every demographic’s repped on Youtube. #UFChat
9:19 am AnassaRh: @tasmin21 Is the Toronto series Tanya Huff’s Blood series? I know that’s mostly set there. #UFChat
9:22 am AnassaRh: @TENscribeshop I think it’s more common to name the city. Can’t assume reader can ID. Most UF is fairly descriptive, though. #UFChat
9:29 am AnassaRh: Chose Vancouver for easy research on budget, more confidence with feel, scarcity of stories. Keeping for racial demographics. #UFChat
9:34 am AnassaRh: Authenticity comes from good description + me having good idea of location/area already. Otherwise, city’s just a place. #UFChat
9:37 am AnassaRh: To be a good setting, city should have history, legends, distinctiveness. Should at least be recognizable, too. #UFChat
9:39 am AnassaRh: Would love more international UF (South America? Asia?), but almost more close to home. Halifax, Montreal, Calgary?. #UFChat
9:39 am AnassaRh: RT @Cameron_Haley: I think diversity is hugely important in UF…otherwise, we get the same cultural traditions and context repeated over and over. #UFchat
9:42 am AnassaRh: My def. of “city” is influenced by my small-city, large-town BG. City is population center, has malls, bars, govt. offices. #UFChat
9:45 am AnassaRh: “City” doesn’t need dense residential areas or famous culture. Doesn’t need to make people nervous after dark. #UFChat
9:47 am AnassaRh: Biggest landmark in my city was the rodeo grounds. Tallest apartment building was 4 stories. Most people had houses. #ufchat
9:48 am AnassaRh: I’m not intending to sound annoyed with Big City UF. Love it! But not all cities follow the same model. #UFChat
9:50 am AnassaRh: Hear, hear! RT @LaylaMessner: Grit: I think it has 2 do w/ knowledge that the world is not simple & clean & easy, not black & white #UFChat
9:51 am AnassaRh: Also grit = realism. Not just one culture, one class, one ethnicity. Conflict. #UFChat
9:53 am AnassaRh: I tend to steer clear of books that seem to accent corruption and decay 2 strongly. Personally find it depressing. Little’s ok, tho. #UFChat
9:59 am AnassaRh: Integrating urban: have to keep the feel and culture of the city in mind. What’s it like downtown? How do people react? #UFChat
10:01 am AnassaRh: Also what do buildings look like? Businesses? What are the demographics in certain areas? Basically, need mental map, and StreetView #UFChat
10:02 am jolantru: @AnassaRh I am writing international UF – story set in Singapore (my own country). #UFchat
10:03 am AnassaRh: I occasionally play at wandering locations and looking through characters’ eyes. Find it inspiring, and helpful when writing. #UFChat
10:04 am AnassaRh: @jolantru I know! Excited for it. But also want others, y’know? #UFChat
10:07 am jolantru: @AnassaRh Yes, we definitely need to have more! #UFchat
10:07 am AnassaRh: I think, to get urban-ness across in open world, should still have look and feel as much as possible. Only change what’s necessary. #UFChat
10:09 am AnassaRh: RT @tasmin21: @UF_Chat Now thinking monster that migrates to breed ever 200 years, only now there’s a city in the way. What happens? #UFChat
10:16 am AnassaRh: For me, diff. btwn UF and contempory fantasy cities is focus. In UF, city is obvs. present, there is snark, there is mystery. #ufchat
10:18 am AnassaRh: In contemporary, city is background. The story just happens to be in a certain city. Not deliberately set there, even when it is. #ufchat
10:21 am AnassaRh: UF treats history, locales as reasons for monsters, places to stage fights. Contemp. sees history as mood/theme/analogy ? #UFChat
10:22 am AnassaRh: ? and locales as places for any number of things to happen. Also, contemp seems to have slower pace, lean more towards epic fantasy. #UFChat
10:22 am AnassaRh: And yes, I know I’ve said some of that in other chats. #UFChat
10:24 am AnassaRh: Lots of great questions on #UFChat tonight! Stayed up way too late answering them. Hope to wake in time for work tomorrow. πŸ˜‰
10:28 am Mariemns: Well.. Lots of great questions on #UFChat tonight! Stayed up way too late answering them. Hope to wake in time for work tomorrow. πŸ˜‰ :@
10:31 am jolantru: RT @AnassaRh: UF treats history, locales as reasons for monsters, places to stage fights. Contemp. sees history as mood/theme/analogy ? #UFChat
10:33 am jolantru: RT @UF_Chat: @tasmin21 You may be interested in @jolantru‘s discussion with me (@inkgypsy) last night about culture etc (under #UFchat hashtag) #UFchat
3:25 pm jhameia: RT @UF_Chat: S: @jolantru?s UF novel debuting 2011 takes place in Singapore (?Wolf at the Door?) – a 1st for the city/country. #UFchat
3:38 pm SusanSizemore: RT @UF_Chat: What Urban Fantasy Means To Me by @SusanSizemore (For Tor blog) The real world with the weird. http://bit.ly/ab1dN4 #UFchat

___________________________________

END OF TRANSCRIPT FOR AUGUST 14th, 2010

Thanks for a busy, fruitful and fun chat everyone! The comments collected will be very useful for people deciding on their next UF location.

Be sure to check out the resource posts/essays and more tweeted at the end of the chat time.

We’ve added a “Published UF authors on Twitter” page to the blog (check the link at the very top of the page) and linked it to a list on Twitter for easy following. This is a list in progress that we’re adding to bit by bit. If you see someone you think should be on there, there’s a good chance we just haven’t gotten to adding them yet BUT please always feel free to add suggestions by @-ing @inkgypsy or @snowppl and we’ll add them to the list ASAP.

Stay tuned to @UF_Chat on Twitter for more details on next week’s special author Q&A with Patti O’Shea! (@Patti_OShea)

See you next week!

Gypsy (@inkgypsy)


Chat Topic: August 14

Here’s what we will be discussing on #UFchat today (Saturday August 14th):

What’s the importance of the β€˜U’ in UF?

What does β€˜urban’ mean to you?

AND

Mapping UF – the ‘WHERE’s (ie. the types of places UF writers base their stories in as well as cities used in UF series),

the WHY of why writers choose to root their stories in a place (eg. from the practical “I’m familiar as it’s my home town”, through “the city has a ton of bridges which are important to my creatures and to my plots”)

& the IMPORTANCE of cities in UF (why cities? What’s a city anyway and why is it important to the UF genre? Why are contemporary fantasies not necessarily UF?).

Lots of great article links today will be tweeted at the end of the chat too so be sure to check the transcript if you have to bail right on the hour.

I’ll be delaying the transcript upload to 36 hrs instead of 24 so all the overseas UF people and those with other commitments can still be part of the discussion as per last week. (Apocalypses excepted.)Please free to add any comments with the #UFchat hashtag to be included.

See you soon – with boots on!

TODAY @ 3pm PST/ 6pm EST!

Follow @UF_Chat for updates and reminders.

See you soon!


Transcript for August 7, 2010 – Secret (closed) worlds vs ‘Revamped’ (open) worlds

TOPIC: Secret (hidden) worlds vs ‘Revamped’ (open) worlds – what is your preference? What do you like to read? To write? What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?

1:25 am AnassaRh: For the night tweeters: On my blog: An Interesting Take on Parapsychology http://bit.ly/caLy40 #ghost #writing #ufchat
4:12 am UF_Chat: #UFchat TOPIC tomorrow: Secret (hidden) worlds vs ‘revamped’ (open) worlds: advantage/disadvantages of each? What’s your preference? 3pm PST
1:20 pm StephanieLMcGee: When it comes to secret vs. re-vamped real world, I’m torn. Love Jasper Fforde’s dystopian take on Earth and love hidden worlds. #UFchat
1:54 pm Sandy_Wills: @inkgypsy I *think* I can make the #UFchat. If I’m home, I’ll definitely be there.
2:37 pm StephanieLMcGee: As for secret worlds, if done well they can be really fun. I like making my character see his world from the eyes of the secret one #UFchat
5:33 pm AnassaRh: Just retweeted 3 myth-related tweets. Great story fodder! Go look?or read @jessnevins latest. πŸ™‚ #ufchat #scifichat
6:09 pm editorialdept: Have any of you been following the UF/Paranormal discussions at the tor.com blog? Interesting stuff! http://bit.ly/caJoFu #ufchat
9:00 pm UF_Chat: Bong, bong, bong! 1 hour till #UFchat! Do you like a secret entrance into a UF world or prefer magic & monsters out on the streets? 3pm PST
9:00 pm inkgypsy: Bong, bong, bong! 1 hour till #UFchat! Do you like a secret entrance into a UF world or prefer magic & monsters out on the streets? 3pm PST
9:30 pm UF_Chat: 1/2 hour countdown to #UFchat! Want your fangs in public or only seen by those in the know? Come discuss hidden vs open magic worlds 3pm PST
9:45 pm UF_Chat: 15 mins to go. Getting my #UFchat boots on – bring your monster spotting goggles – they could be anywhere.. hidden vs open worlds @3pm PST!
9:48 pm editorialdept: RT @UF_Chat: 15 min. countdown to #UFchat! Want your fangs in public or only seen by those in the know? Hidden vs open magic worlds 3pm PST
9:49 pm deargdawn: @Jinxie_G what is #UFChat?
9:50 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @deargdawn It’s a magical place where we dance whenever we’re able. #UFChat
9:50 pm inkgypsy: @kazmahoney Oh that would be awesome! Feel free to mention your books & what kind of worlds you like to build (hidden vs open) #UFchat
9:51 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @deargdawn Urban Fantasy chat – sorry about the gratuitous camelot reference. #UFChat
9:52 pm inkgypsy: @deargdawn Urban fantasy chat – all kinds – literary, dark, comic, PR overlap, noir… all UF all the time. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
9:54 pm Shawn_II: Gonna kick back and check out the #UFChat today.
9:55 pm UF_Chat: I’m swapping my @inkgypsy hat for my @UF_chat hat (it has awesome horns). Boots, check. Goggles, check. Official #UFchat badge, check! πŸ˜‰
9:55 pm inkgypsy: I’m swapping my @inkgypsy hat for my @UF_chat hat (it has awesome horns). Boots, check. Goggles, check. Official #UFchat badge, check! πŸ˜‰
9:56 pm wildbloom: I finally made it to one of the chats this week. Yay me. #ufchat
9:57 pm UF_Chat: @Shawn_II Whoo yeah! We got Da Fang today! Looking forward to your two bites… πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
9:57 pm leapetra: I didn’t think I would make it, but all our guests have left, computer free! #ufchat
9:57 pm wildbloom: @AuthorWilliam Hi William! I know, look at me go. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
9:58 pm AuthorWilliam: @wildbloom LOL πŸ™‚ #ufchat
9:58 pm leapetra: Hidden or out in the open worlds, I like to mix it up. like platform 9 3/4 #ufchat
9:58 pm Shawn_II: @UF_Chat Don’t know how much I’ll participate, but I’ll hang out for a bit. *winks* #UFchat
9:59 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I like a hidden but porous environment. #UFchat
9:59 pm leapetra: @Ben_Aaronovitch I like that better #ufchat
9:59 pm MeganCurd: Hey all! I’m finally getting to be here for the chat! πŸ™‚ What’s the topic? #ufchat
10:00 pm 12threefour: having a mix both secret/none works. because things that go bump in the night are around, doesn’t mean they show themselves always. #UFChat
10:00 pm UF_Chat: 3, 2… and we are now live with #UFchat! Hope you have your boots on – we have a lot of ground to cover today! #UFchat
10:00 pm tasmin21: @UF_Chat Not going to be able to follow #UFChat again this week. 😦 Bad author, no donut.
10:00 pm Jinxie_G: I actually prefer the hidden world to the everyone knows about the things that go bump in the night. #UFChat
10:00 pm UF_Chat: @12threefour Hi! You got it in! Good to see you. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:00 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @UF_Chat: 3, 2… and we are now live with #UFchat! Hope you have your boots on – we have a lot of ground to cover today! #UFchat
10:01 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I also like the idea that things are beginning to seep in through the cracks. #UFchat
10:01 pm UF_Chat: @tasmin21 We’ll miss you – you can always add comments for the transcript. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:01 pm CameronHaleyUF: Howdy all! #UFchat
10:01 pm AshelynnS: Hidden world, definitely. #UFchat
10:01 pm 12threefour: M/S and Tweetchat open, so I might read more than I post, but hey… ~waves~ #UFchat
10:01 pm Jinxie_G: LOVE @msmissyjane‘s world in They Call Me Death, though, bc when shifters become public, there’s an all-out war. #UFChat
10:01 pm UF_Chat: Do you prefer spy cams or front page photo ops 2 catch sight of your magic/monsters? While we settle here’s some announcements: #UFchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: Announcement: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFchat
10:02 pm leapetra: If you are using a hidden world, think of something better, like the magic only works there ,or something #ufchat
10:02 pm AuthorWilliam: Locked an loaded for today’s #UFchat! TOPIC: Hidden worlds vs. open worlds ? Preference? What are advantages of & disadvantages of each?
10:02 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Fear/Hatred. It depends on the motives for the world being hidden. #UFchat
10:02 pm UF_Chat: UF authors on Twitter w new books/anthos out: @KelleyArmstrong @RachelCaine @Jeaniene_Frost @lilithsaintcrow @katiemacalister #UFchat
10:03 pm UF_Chat: More Twitter UF authors with new books out last week: @trentonomicon @MistressKrisG @katrchrdsn @Kate4Queen @DevynQuinn #UFchat
10:03 pm UF_Chat: Special announcement from @RachelCaine next tweet: (due to illness & missing yesterday?s signing appearance she has xtra offer) #UFchat
10:03 pm UF_Chat: RT @rachelcaine I *will be* at Legacy tonight @ 7 pm & I will not only sign whatever anyone brings but will take U to dinner too. #UFchat
10:03 pm 12threefour: @leapetra like harry potter were the muggle saw plain boring stuff instead of the magical. Or fairy magic working best in nevernever #UFchat
10:04 pm UF_Chat: Phew! Front announcements done & people already into the secret versus open/remade magic world topic. What’s your preference? #UFchat
10:04 pm editorialdept: I tend to write worlds where “other” is out in the open, but the full depth of “other” remains a mystery w/ room to explore #ufchat
10:04 pm AuthorWilliam: I think hidden worlds are a great choice, the danger is when the characters that are aware of the hidden world have too much status #ufchat
10:05 pm valerievaldes: RT @UF_Chat: 3, 2… and we are now live with #UFchat! Hope you have your boots on – we have a lot of ground to cover today! #UFchat
10:05 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I think the vast majority of people already half-believe in some kind of supernatural so may be easier to hide in plain sight. #UFChat
10:05 pm UF_Chat: Harry Potter is specifically a ‘hidden’ world where only those in the know knew about the magic & creatures. Dresden Files also. #UFchat
10:05 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I’m not expressing this very well. #UFchat
10:05 pm 12threefour: My main issue with all secret, or all open is people aren’t like that. Why would all monsters think alike and want the same thing? #UFchat
10:05 pm leapetra: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: I think the vast majority of people already half-believe in some kind of supernatural… hide in plain sight. #ufchat
10:05 pm UF_Chat: The Rachel Morgan series (K. Harrisson) is open – the vamps/wolves ‘came out’ and the world as we know it changed. #UFchat
10:06 pm AudryT: The rumors that they bite are mostly untrue. πŸ˜‰ RT@kazmahoney …lurking at my first ever #UFchat. It seems quite friendly so far…
10:06 pm Patti_OShea: RT @UF_Chat: Announcement: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFchat
10:06 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @leapetra Thank you. #ufchat
10:06 pm leapetra: I like the hide in plain sight. Remember the troll market in Hellboy 2 it was right under the Brooklyn Bridge. #ufchat
10:06 pm kjhatch: Both hidden and open can be great, but I like the contrast and discovery of hidden more. I’m drawn in more to the setting. #UFChat
10:06 pm UF_Chat: @12threefour Think the main thing re ‘open’ is if creatures out in open then impact on world is huge – changes everything. #UFchat
10:07 pm editorialdept: In Changer, Lindskold let sasquatches find each other online, in sequel Legends Walking, Pan and satyrs played “costumed” dancers #ufchat
10:07 pm leapetra: What if they are in “open” but humans condition themselves not to see it? #ufchat
10:08 pm miranda00writes: I prefer closed worlds – I find the idea of a hidden world interesting. #UFchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: Personally (as @inkgypsy) I write and prefer ‘hidden’ where world is same as we know it with extras – but love reading both. #UFchat
10:08 pm editorialdept: It was a fun exploration of how modern technology could allow paranormal entities to mix & mingle in real world w/o being truly out #ufchat
10:08 pm Shawn_II: Only some of us bite. #UFchat
10:08 pm leapetra: The classic SEP. Somebody Else’s Problem #ufchat
10:08 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra He he – you could argue we do that anyway. There’s a lot people choose not to see. That’s classified as ‘hidden’ tho. #UFchat
10:08 pm CameronHaleyUF: I agree, UF_Chat: Of the “open” worlds, I prefer the ones that are damn near post-apocalyptic (Kate Daniels, Downside, etc.). #UFchat
10:08 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Open can be fun too. #UFChat
10:09 pm kjhatch: I think even in an open world there should be a second layer that’s hidden, a place for those who don’t like or want to be known. #UFChat
10:09 pm AshelynnS: @UF_Chat I prefer writing in a hidden world, but I do have a few stories with an open world. #UFchat
10:09 pm leapetra: The Night Watch series handled it well. It was open, but there were layers, that an other could go, humans couldn’t #ufchat
10:09 pm AuthorWilliam: Open worlds do create major shifts but can explore some of how our society deals with things that are different. X-men comes to mind #ufchat
10:09 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @leapetra People do it for everything else why not the supernatural? #ufchat
10:10 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra Hide in plain sight is awesome premise. Falls on the side of ‘hidden’ as far as definitions go, even tho is blurring line #UFchat
10:10 pm Jinxie_G: I ❀ P Briggs’ Mercy Thompson series bc it shows a bit of both worlds and majority of magical world hidden, never to be revealed. #UFChat
10:10 pm leapetra: Most of my stories are semi open, you have to find your “doorway” in, or know the password. #ufchat
10:10 pm inkgypsy: RT @CameronHaleyUF: I agree, UF_Chat: Of the “open” worlds, I prefer the ones that are damn near post-apocalyptic (Kate Daniels, Downside, etc.). #UFchat
10:10 pm wildbloom: —mingle in society. #ufchat
10:11 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @kjhatch: I think even in an open world there should be a second layer that’s hidden, a place for those who don’t like or want to be known. #UFChat
10:11 pm CameronHaleyUF: I’m trying to show both sides in The Underworld Cycle. It’s hidden in MOB RULES but becomes more open as the series progresses. #UFchat
10:11 pm leapetra: @Ben_Aaronovitch Or to hide a spaceship, Thank you Douglas Adams. #ufchat
10:11 pm AuthorWilliam: @kjhatch Interesting – I like. #ufchat
10:12 pm Jinxie_G: @UF_Chat I don’t know about that. @msmissyjane kept it pretty much UF and paranormal in her book. #UFChat
10:12 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I think it’s easier to have half-open in England because of the historical nature of some institutions. #UFChat
10:12 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat It could, but why not. Some sci fi works better as fantasy and not hard sci fi #ufchat
10:12 pm UF_Chat: QUESTION: So what are the advantages of having an OPEN world as opposed to a closed one? (And vice versa) #UFchat
10:12 pm editorialdept: RT @UF_Chat: open world – does anyone feel it pushes toward soft-sci-fi? <<not unless magic is out due to technology. Magic=fantasy #ufchat
10:13 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @AuthorWilliam I like the idea of layers. #UFChat
10:13 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra I agree – I think it hops along the borders of soft sci-fi. In fact I’ve read a definite overlap. Find it fascinating. #UFchat
10:13 pm 12threefour: @Ben_Aaronovitch like Simon Green “The Nightside” it’s all a parallel universe were weird stuff lives. #UFchat
10:14 pm jflamingo2: I’m open to ‘open’ worlds too but I have to dream it just right in my head. It takes some getting used to the way that world works. #UFchat
10:14 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept How about magic as a new technology? EG Devon Monk’s series? #UFchat
10:14 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat Open probably allows more world-building…less of the world is as we know it relative to closed. #UFchat
10:14 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @UF_Chat Lots of fun integrating classic ‘monsters’ into human society. cf: Ankh Morpork. #UFchat
10:14 pm wildbloom: @UF_Chat I think there’s advantages to both, depending on the story. Whatever one makes it more interesting. #ufchat
10:14 pm editorialdept: Adv. of open world – less need to explain. If open is the norm, you don’t have to harp on why no one is surprised by a talking cat. #ufchat
10:15 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat Exploration of friction in and open society – allegoric of cultural bias and prejudice is one advantage #ufchat
10:15 pm UF_Chat: Neil Gaiman’s Neverwhere with London Below was essentially a parallel world. Essentially hidden for this definition. #UFchat
10:15 pm leapetra: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: @UF_Chat Lots of fun integrating classic monsters into human society. cf: Ankh Morpork. YAY! #ufchat
10:15 pm 12threefour: if supes walked the world, to me, it would just make sense they would have an ‘out’ world for mundanes, and a hidden world for them #UFchat
10:15 pm editorialdept: @UF_Chat Haven’t read that, but it’s going on my list now. Haven’t seen that kind of crossover yet! #ufchat
10:15 pm AudryT: Tricky to handle a secret world when your narrator doesn’t know about it, but the reader does or can guess early on. #ufchat
10:15 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @leapetra Plus America has towns that nobody knows exists. #ufchat
10:15 pm AuthorWilliam: @Ben_Aaronovitch Right on, me too. Give the writer freedom the reader a dynamic look. #ufchat
10:16 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat I don’t think it’s soft-scifi unless the open world is detailed to the point of pseudo-science. #UFChat
10:16 pm 12threefour: non-supes do that now…look at us, we have our own forums/conventions/etc. that aren’t public or advertised on television. #UFchat
10:16 pm jflamingo2: If it’s not soft sci-fi, than it may be considered dystopia. Or are they considered about the same thing? #UFchat
10:17 pm AuthorWilliam: @UF_Chat A hidden society creates immediate tension with there being something of huge important that the masses are unaware of #ufchat
10:17 pm leapetra: people believe in Alien complexes underground, So why not trolls instead? #ufchat
10:17 pm AudryT: @UF_Chat I’d say all world building is difficult, if you want to make it convincing. #ufchat
10:17 pm editorialdept: @UF_Chat I think open worlds allow the author to write in shorthand about magic, but world must still be fully realized to be “real” #ufchat
10:17 pm TheSpinecracker: RT @UF_Chat: TODAY?S TOPIC: Hidden worlds versus open worlds ? what do you prefer? What are advantages & disadvantages of each? #UFchat #UFchat
10:17 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat I think a well drawn open world requires more world building and more effort to enagage that suspension of disbelief #UFchat
10:18 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept Magic is essentially the new technology and comes with a heavy price of use. 1st here http://amzn.to/cNDUnt #UFchat
10:18 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @AudryT World Building is the most fun you can have on your own. #ufchat
10:18 pm 12threefour: @leapetra are you implying there are not trolls under bridges? Who are those guys who keep asking me to pay tolls? 😦 #UFchat
10:18 pm leapetra: Sounds like there are many forms of hidden, from hiding away from humans to hiding in plain sight. I like the latter. #ufchat
10:18 pm AudryT: @AuthorWilliam Most humans are too egotistical to accept that other intelligent life-forms might also be native. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:18 pm Mad_Hatter_Tea: RT @leapetra: people believe in Alien complexes underground, So why not trolls instead? #ufchat
10:19 pm leapetra: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: @AudryT World Building is the most fun you can have on your own. #ufchat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: @AudryT πŸ˜‰ (You got it! It’s not simpler in one form than another if you’re going for believability.) #UFchat
10:19 pm kjhatch: Lots of SF is soft too; as long as the basis is science it’s not sci-fantasy; UF as soft-scifi needs to establish its own sci basis #UFChat
10:19 pm UF_Chat: @AudryT I love that – case in point – we learn more about animals every year – eg dolphins, chimps, whales even have cultures. #UFchat
10:20 pm AuthorWilliam: World building can create a burden of building authenticity (@AudryT) But it offers freedom to author and a unique journey to reader #ufchat
10:20 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @leapetra If your planning on a long series its best to have many layers so your supernatural characters can be surprised as well #ufchat
10:20 pm UF_Chat: RT @kjhatch: Lots of SF is soft too; as long as the basis is science it’s not sci-fantasy; UF as soft-scifi needs to establish its own sci basis #UFChat
10:21 pm inkgypsy: RT @AudryT: @AuthorWilliam Most humans are too egotistical to accept that other intelligent life-forms might also be native. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:21 pm VampBookClub: Both have their advantages. Monsters in the open allows for societal allegories and a shift from typical dynamics. #UFchat
10:21 pm UF_Chat: RT @12threefour: @leapetra are you implying there are not trolls under bridges? Who are those guys who keep asking me to pay tolls? 😦 #UFchat
10:21 pm BillNigh: RT @leapetra: people believe in Alien complexes underground, So why not trolls instead? #ufchat ~ Why choose?
10:22 pm leapetra: Best part in planing your world is how much is “real” and how much do you make up #ufchat
10:22 pm VampBookClub: Though, with the monsters hidden we get the thrilling ‘bump in the night’ factor and get to feel like we’re in on something. #UFchat
10:22 pm kjhatch: @UF_Chat I don’t think open worlds require more world building than anything else; setting details can be light or detailed. #UFChat
10:22 pm AuthorWilliam: RT @AudryT: @AuthorWilliam Most humans are too egotistical to accept that other intelligent life-forms might also be native. πŸ˜‰ #ufchat
10:22 pm leapetra: From my first novel: People are slaughtered in a vampire fight. News reports end of the world cult went on a killing spree. #ufchat
10:23 pm inkgypsy: RT @AudryT: @UF_Chat I’d say all world building is difficult, if you want to make it convincing. #ufchat
10:23 pm AudryT: Yes! RT@VampBookClub: With monsters hidden we get the thrilling bump in the night factor and get to feel like were in on something. #ufchat
10:23 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @VampBookClub Or if they’ve been assimulated a ‘bump in the day’ moment. #UFchat
10:23 pm UF_Chat: @AuthorWilliam Agree hidden = auto tension but also the new adjust period is fascinating too – MUCH tension there #UFchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: @jflamingo2 Dytopia – that word is appearing a LOT in UF right now. Usually re open worlds. #UFchat
10:24 pm AudryT: @AudryT And even if the reader guesses at the secrets, the revelation can still be thrilling if handled well. #ufchat
10:24 pm kjhatch: Totally agree RT @AuthorWilliam A hidden society creates immediate tension with something of huge import & the masses are unaware #ufchat
10:24 pm UF_Chat: RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: @VampBookClub Or if theyve been assimulated a bump in the day moment. #UFchat
10:24 pm AuthorWilliam: @VampBookClub Definitely. The audience gets to be in the know. Can be a delightful device to play with! #ufchat
10:24 pm jflamingo2: Both worlds, open or hidden, would take effort to build up. The key would be that it felt real and believable – what people grasp #UFchat
10:25 pm inkgypsy: RT @VampBookClub: Though, with the monsters hidden we get the thrilling ‘bump in the night’ factor and get to feel like we’re in on something. #UFchat
10:25 pm CameronHaleyUF: @inkgypsy Yes, and I imagine it depends on how extensive the supernatural element is, too. Limited supes = easier to “open” #UFchat
10:25 pm VampBookClub: That, too! RT @Ben_Aaronovitch: Or if they’ve been assimulated a ‘bump in the day’ moment. #UFchat
10:25 pm AudryT: @UF_Chat I’m pretty sure the chimps are plotting to take over. #betterwatchyourmangos #ufchat
10:26 pm UF_Chat: RT @VampBookClub: Both have their advantages. Monsters in the open allows for societal allegories and a shift from typical dynamics. #UFchat
10:26 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: On staying hidden: media coverage is much more sporadic and patchy then people realise. #UFChat
10:26 pm kjhatch: @VampBookClub I agree, but hidden monsters can serve the same allegorical function if the hidden world mirrors/echos the open #UFChat
10:26 pm leapetra: @AudryT If the cats don’t beat them too it (what am I saying give the cats a window with sunlight, they wouldn’t care) #ufchat
10:26 pm amandha_katsu: RT @VampBookClub: Both have their advantages. Monsters in the open allows for societal allegories and a shift from typical dynamics. #UFchat
10:27 pm inkgypsy: @CameronHaleyUF Agreed! I like the differing challenges of each tho I more naturally write closed myself. Important to read both. #UFchat
10:27 pm AuthorWilliam: Absolutely! RT @VampBookClub Monsters in the open allows for societal allegories and a shift from typical dynamics. #UFchat
10:27 pm jflamingo2: Wow, dystopia: to re-open a world. I like that suggestion. Brilliant! @UF_Chat #UFchat
10:27 pm editorialdept: @leapetra we can subdue our potential cat overlords with bonito flakes, fuzzy blankets and belly rubs. Catnip for heavy artillery πŸ™‚ #ufchat
10:28 pm amandha_katsu: RT @VampBookClub: Though, with the monsters hidden we get the thrilling ‘bump in the night’ factor and get to feel like we’re in on something. #UFchat
10:28 pm inkgypsy: @StaciaKane You have any announcements you want to make? #UFchat is on right now & buzzing. πŸ™‚ (Dystopia came up)
10:28 pm Jinxie_G: @LeanneBennett In the #UFChat? Yes.
10:28 pm VampBookClub: RT @kjhatch: @VampBookClub I agree, but hidden monsters can serve the same allegorical function if the hidden world mirrors/echos the open #UFChat
10:28 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept LOL! (catnip for werecats) It actually works on leopards, lions etc so why not? #UFchat
10:29 pm rixshep: RT @leapetra: I like the hide in plain sight. Remember the troll market in Hellboy 2 it was right under the Brooklyn Bridge. #ufchat
10:29 pm UF_Chat: RT @kjhatch: @VampBookClub I agree, but hidden monsters can serve the same allegorical function if the hidden world mirrors/echos the open #UFChat
10:30 pm 12threefour: The world can still be affected even if the monsters are hidden. great misdirection to be had in ex vampire killers #UFchat
10:30 pm AudryT: Struggling right now w/writing a secret world where the reader will expect one surprise and get another. #layersonlayers #abitch #ufchat
10:30 pm 12threefour: er, explaining… not former-vampires πŸ™‚ #UFchat
10:30 pm UF_Chat: @kjhatch Good point there! Closed doesn’t have to be all about ‘hiding’. #UFchat
10:31 pm kjhatch: @VampBookClub I think the issue is that to get the same effect, you almost have to take an complete open world and hide it. #ufchat
10:31 pm leapetra: RT @UF_Chat: @kjhatch Good point there! Closed doesnt have to be all about hiding. #ufchat
10:31 pm rixshep: rt @UF_Chat @12threefour ‘Open’ if creatures out in open then huge impact on world – changes everything. #UFchat / I like to see impact!
10:31 pm UF_Chat: @jbeemills There are a lot out there in the open. πŸ™‚ I can get you recommendations after the chat or others may have some here too. #UFchat
10:32 pm AuthorWilliam: @leapetra Sounds like your point exactly, hidden in plain sight. >> “Closed doesnt have to be all about hiding. #ufchat
10:32 pm jbeemills: @UF_Chat Thanks! @inkgypsy was getting me some recs the other day, too. I’m interested, but not informed about this genre. #ufchat
10:33 pm AudryT: @jbeemills “Mom, it’s that werewolf eating our trash again!” “That’s just a homeless man in a fur coat, dear.” “Wake up, Mom.” #ufchat
10:33 pm jflamingo2: RT @jbeemills: Hi! Just jumping in. I don’t write UF (yet), but I would like to see monsters out in the open that most everyone’s in denial about. #ufchat
10:33 pm VampBookClub: @kjhatch World-building in itself can be tedious if not done carefully, crafting two without overwhelming readers can be hard #UFchat
10:33 pm kjhatch: It also leads to the other world/dimension setting where the hidden is not hidden, just permanently separate. #UFChat
10:33 pm editorialdept: One of my favorite tropes is magic in the open, but secret societies to explore. It’s like a good thriller/spy novel w/ magic #ufchat
10:34 pm jbeemills: @AudryT Exactly! Ha ha ha ha! #ufchat
10:34 pm UF_Chat: I haz tweet delay – sorry folks! #UFchat
10:34 pm leapetra: Hard to put a fully open world in modern society, easier to rewrite history #ufchat
10:34 pm inkgypsy: RT @VampBookClub: @kjhatch World-building in itself can be tedious if not done carefully, crafting two without overwhelming readers can be hard #UFchat
10:35 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I have the gods of the tributaries of the Thames playing an active role in London politics – behind the scenes. #UFchat
10:35 pm rixshep: Altho #Sanctuary is “scifi” it fits closed UF very well. ‘Normals’ refuse to see what they don’t want to. #ufchat
10:35 pm VampBookClub: RT @UF_Chat QUESTION: What are people’s favorite ‘closed’ world books & fave ‘open’ world books & why? #UFchat
10:36 pm rixshep: In ‘open’, author has to rebuild the ‘real’ world to show impact. In ‘closed’, has to explain how it manages to remain hidden. #ufchat
10:36 pm jbeemills: @AudryT Or maybe the children are the only ones that can see the monsters. Very Twilight Zone. #ufchat
10:36 pm VampBookClub: Favorite open would be @StaciaKane‘s new Downside Ghosts series, @burningbunnies The Hollows and early Southern Vampire Mysteries #UFchat
10:36 pm kjhatch: @VampBookClub Oh definitely! I think limiting the readers’ exposure or providing a guide mechanism is helpful then. #UFChat
10:36 pm jflamingo2: @jbeemills I’d like to see those perspectives on those monsters that people are in denial about. See them differently. Change up. #UFchat
10:36 pm 12threefour: I really like the way SOOKIE STACKHOUSE novels merged both. Vamps were out and about, but the shifters had their own rules. #UFchat
10:37 pm leapetra: World building should not be done for the reader, unless you are writing something like Tolkien. #ufchat
10:37 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: @jbeemills I like that. #ufchat
10:37 pm UF_Chat: QUESTION: What do people think about the ‘mix’ of supernatural in there – human vs half human vs all non-human? #UFchat
10:38 pm rixshep: rt @AuthorWilliam @UF_Chat Exploration of friction in and open society – allegoric of cultural bias and prejudice is one advantage #ufchat
10:38 pm UF_Chat: How does the mixing of human and non affect open and closed world building? #UFchat
10:38 pm 12threefour: @UF_Chat I’m pro-mix (obviously) #UFchat
10:38 pm VampBookClub: RT @12threefour: I really like the way SOOKIE STACKHOUSE novels merged both. Vamps were out, but the shifters had their own rules. #UFchat
10:38 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat It could work, for me you better have the biological reasons why it would happen. #ufchat
10:38 pm AudryT: Good picks. RT @VampBookClub: Favorite open would be @StaciaKane‘s new Downside Ghosts series, @burningbunnies The Hollows… #ufchat
10:38 pm CameronHaleyUF: Favorite closed: Tim Powers “Declare.” He created a whole secret occult history of the Cold War. #UFchat
10:39 pm rixshep: rt @kjhatch Lots of SF soft too; as long as basis is science it’s not sci-fantasy; UF as soft-scifi needs its own sci basis #UFChat
10:39 pm VampBookClub: @UF_Chat Bring on the nephilim! #UFchat
10:40 pm AuthorWilliam: A: I think whenever you work with a “child of two worlds” an opportunity for a unique and telling perspective can be seized. #ufchat
10:40 pm leapetra: although discworld is considered “straight” fantasy #ufchat
10:40 pm rixshep: rt @AudryT @UF_Chat I’d say all world building is difficult, if you want to make it convincing. #ufchat
10:40 pm jbeemills: @jflamingo2 Fear can transform your perspective pretty easily. It could work well. #ufchat
10:40 pm leapetra: @VampBookClub OMG guess what I was researching today, and the Annunaki #ufchat
10:40 pm UF_Chat: When we blend human and non who are the real monsters then? What do people truly fear in ‘open’ worlds if they know what goes bump? #UFchat
10:41 pm 12threefour: I think mixing humans gives you a jumping point to carry into sub-arcs that can develop the char and way s/he works in their world. #UFchat
10:41 pm AuthorWilliam: Awesome. RT @VampireBookClub @UF_Chat Bring on the nephilim! #UFchat
10:41 pm leapetra: @UF_Chat if you know that is a werewolf making that bump, you still would be scared. like the bear going through your yard. #ufchat
10:41 pm AudryT: As readers, what can end up frustrating you about secret worlds? The secret being obvious? The world being shallow in the end? #ufchat
10:42 pm UF_Chat: UF definitely has the whole ‘alien among us’ approach. Clear in closed & newly open worlds. What about long-time open ones? #UFchat
10:42 pm amandha_katsu: @VampBookClub Closed: Women of the Otherworld by Kelley Armstrong / Open: Sookie Stackhouse #UFchat
10:42 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat I don’t think it’s necessarily any less frightening when you know there really is a monster under your bed. πŸ˜‰ #UFchat
10:42 pm editorialdept: RT @UF_Chat: What do people truly fear in open worlds if they know what goes bump? <<death, pain, loss-more universal themes #ufchat
10:42 pm wildbloom: @Ben_Aaronovitch Yes. It was almost required for that particular story. Lots of tension. #ufchat
10:42 pm leapetra: @AudryT for me it the hiding because they think the humans fear them. #ufchat
10:42 pm 12threefour: @AudryT for me, it’s when the suspension of belief just won’t get me over the fact something is happening. #UFchat
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @leapetra Hopefully yes – though you’d be surprised how many people think ‘cool’ and forget about the danger (Yellowstone probs) #UFchat
10:43 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: I always like the fairie/human stuff aspect of Vance’s Lyonesse. #UFChat
10:43 pm rixshep: rt @AuthorWilliam World building can create burden of authenticity (@AudryT) But offers freedom to author & nique journey to reader #ufchat
10:43 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept Agreed – themes get more universal – essentially the monsters/fear factor becomes hidden again. #UFchat
10:44 pm VampBookClub: Even in long open world people will fear the ‘other’ and still may not have first-hand experiences with said ‘monsters” #UFchat
10:44 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat And it’s true that some open worlds humanize the monsters to such an extent that they lose their edge. #UFchat
10:45 pm leapetra: I’m playing around with the idea vampires are hidden, because popular culture has portrayed the wrong image. (1/2) #ufchat
10:45 pm AuthorWilliam: @AudryT For me its when those that know about the world are given too high of a status and those in the dark are played too dumbish #ufchat
10:45 pm 12threefour: @CameronHaleyUF very true, and it makes me sad. 😦 Monsters are not people, why would they constantly act like them. #UFchat
10:45 pm leapetra: So they can hunt in the open as long as they act like the popular image of a vampire. (2/2) #ufchat
10:45 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: World building offers the chance to build worlds! How cool is that? #UFchat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: @CameronHaleyUF Agreed but if is ‘normal’ then people ‘can’ quickly be desensitized. Separates 2 groups of people there I think. #UFchat
10:46 pm UF_Chat: RT @AudryT: As readers, what can end up frustrating you about secret worlds? The secret being obvious? The world being shallow in the end? #ufchat
10:46 pm editorialdept: I think one failure of worldbuilding is when an author makes all character hopes/fears based on human interests #ufchat
10:46 pm AudryT: @UF_Chat We are jaded in this day and age. We’d probably mistake a werewolf for a promotional hologram. #ufchat
10:47 pm editorialdept: Robin McKinley did a great job of keeping the vampires alien/other in Sunshine, despite potential to make them soft & human-like #ufchat
10:47 pm JulieeJohnsonn: hey fellow urban fantasy enthusiasts, writer/readers, #ufchat is in progress! hurry on over! see you there!
10:47 pm Reader_Writer: RT @AuthorWilliam Looking to get some #amreading time in before this afternoon’s #UFchat. http://bit.ly/9d9yvz
10:47 pm UF_Chat: @AudryT LOL you might just be right – I live near Hollywood: Was that an accident or a movie? (not kidding either) #UFchat
10:47 pm VampBookClub: @CameronHaleyUF Agreed. Sometimes it’s worse to know what’s after you, and that those stories of monsters are real. #UFchat
10:47 pm UF_Chat: RT @editorialdept: Robin McKinley did a great job of keeping the vampires alien/other in Sunshine, despite potential to make them soft & human-like #ufchat
10:48 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat Agreed, but I don’t think “open” necessarily implies “normal.” Still plenty to be afraid of, for example, in “I Am Legend.” #UFchat
10:48 pm AudryT: @editorialdept Meaning, the human interests take priority or are considered more important? #ufchat
10:48 pm UF_Chat: RT @JulieeJohnsonn: hey fellow urban fantasy enthusiasts, writer/readers, #ufchat is in progress! hurry on over! see you there!
10:48 pm rixshep: rt @UF_Chat @AudryT LOL you might be right – I live near Hollywood: Was that an accident or a movie? (not kidding either) #UFchat // Heh!
10:48 pm AudryT: @editorialdept Oh, wait, you mean when other species come of as behaving like humans with accessories. #ufchat
10:48 pm UF_Chat: @Reader_Writer #UFchat is on right now. πŸ™‚ 10 minutes-ish to go still – come join us.
10:49 pm editorialdept: @AudryT I guess I’m trying to get at how it’s a failure of imagination to fail to remind readers what sets paranormals apart #ufchat
10:49 pm UF_Chat: @CameronHaleyUF Ooh – forgot about that – different again! Humans become the endangered species. #UFchat
10:50 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept I also have seen a tendency to have paranormals be just like humans – esp in YA. Think it dilutes the impact. #UFchat
10:50 pm LaylaMessner: My internet went down – just made it to Mom’s. What’s on deck? #UFChat
10:50 pm AudryT: @editorialdept For some books, the paranormal is nothing more than window dressing for an otherwise normal story. #ufchat
10:51 pm editorialdept: @AudryT humans w/ access.-ha! yes, + failing to illustrate WHY paranormals are “other”, and drive it home. culture/desire/motivation #ufchat
10:51 pm UF_Chat: @VampBookClub Hence the thriller aspect & noir being popular plot vehicles for UF I think. #UFchat
10:52 pm kjhatch: I’m afraid I need to to run; thanks for the chat all, was fun! #UFChat
10:52 pm AudryT: @editorialdept So rarely is a unique culture built around another species. Usually just variation on human culture. #ufchat
10:52 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner Hidden vs open. What do you prefer? Is it worse for all 2 know monster real or 2 be only one who knows? #UFchat
10:52 pm AuthorWilliam: @kjhatch enjoy your day! #ufchat
10:52 pm 12threefour: Sorry guys, MS is calling me names now… have to go. thanks for the flow of ideas, great chat! #UFchat
10:53 pm UF_Chat: @AudryT That seems to be more a sci-fi trope – building unique culture on other species tho are some in UF too. #UFchat
10:53 pm leapetra: It is important to think about how the paranormals interact. For me I used animal society structures #ufchat
10:53 pm last_lines: hi all..first time in this chat..is it held weekly? #ufchat
10:53 pm editorialdept: Precisely! RT @AudryT: So rarely is a unique culture built around another species. Usually just variation on human culture. #ufchat
10:53 pm UF_Chat: RT @AudryT: @editorialdept Oh, wait, you mean when other species come of as behaving like humans with accessories. #ufchat
10:54 pm rixshep: rt @CameronHaleyUF @UF_Chat It’s true some open worlds humanize monsters to such extent they lose their edge. #UFchat / Good point!
10:54 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat Hmm. I definitely prefer hidden – but I have no idea why πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
10:54 pm leapetra: @last_lines yes it is #ufchat
10:54 pm editorialdept: One of my fave authors, Jane Lindskold, had a post on Tor blog about how most werewolves don’t have much basis in real wolf behavior #ufchat
10:54 pm inkgypsy: @VampBookClub True (re long open not 1st hand) Look how bad we are with different cultures still! #UFchat
10:54 pm rixshep: @last_lines Every Saturday, 3pm pst. #ufchat
10:55 pm AudryT: Is there a secret world hidden in our normal world that y’all would like to live in? Other than Harry Potter’s. #nottheeasyones #ufchat
10:55 pm UF_Chat: @last_lines Hi! Yes a weekly chat. πŸ™‚ 3pm PST/ 6pm EST Urban fantasy all the time! #UFchat
10:55 pm leapetra: @editorialdept She’s right, most werewolves in stories our based on our fear of what wolves could do. #ufchat
10:55 pm Jinxie_G: @editorialdept Mine do. #UFChat
10:55 pm inkgypsy: RT @editorialdept: One of my fave authors, Jane Lindskold, had a post on Tor blog about how most werewolves don’t have much basis in real wolf behavior #ufchat
10:56 pm AudryT: Oh, Lord, it’s always the ones with typos that get RT’d. *sigh* #ufchat
10:56 pm editorialdept: If you’re going to set up your para. folk as uniquely “other”, be sure to stick to it & don’t dilute them into humans w/ fangs/fur #ufchat
10:56 pm rixshep: rt @editorialdept if author wants were-folk 2b humans w/fur, fine, but if meant to be nuanced ‘monsters’, show reader WHY #ufchat // Yes!
10:56 pm leapetra: @AudryT Find me the L-Space path to Discworld and I would be happy. #ufchat
10:56 pm UF_Chat: @editorialdept We’ll be having a topic about monsters and man soon too. Think that would be a good article to bring to table. #UFchat
10:56 pm UF_Chat: Some UF resources on today?s topic (hidden & open UF worlds) for writers & readers in the next few tweets: #UFchat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: Grounding Fantasy in Reality by Laura Bickle http://bit.ly/c0st90 #UFchat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: Worlds Within Worlds by Timothy Doyle http://bit.ly/bRkFf9 #UFchat
10:57 pm rixshep: rt @UF_Chat rt @editorialdept I have seen tendency to have paranormals be just like humans – esp in YA. Think it dilutes impact. #UFchat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: The Two Types of Urban Fantasy from Atsiko?s Chimney blog http://bit.ly/duiU2Z #UFchat
10:57 pm last_lines: @leapetra Thanks and also thanks for sending me the link #ufchat
10:57 pm UF_Chat: Reminder: UF writers announcement: Sheep & Wolves contest http://bit.ly/bx23QL Write traditional monster from new perspective. #UFchat
10:57 pm AudryT: RT @UF_Chat: Grounding Fantasy in Reality by Laura Bickle http://bit.ly/c0st90 #ufchat
10:58 pm Jinxie_G: Interesting chat today. I’m going to go work now, since I haven’t been able to all week. *waves* Laters. #UFChat
10:58 pm last_lines: @UF_Chat Thanks…I will definitely be joining. Love fantasy and am at work on my first fantasy novel.. #ufchat
10:58 pm UF_Chat: RT @rixshep: rt @editorialdept if author wants were-folk 2b humans w/fur, fine, but if meant to be nuanced ‘monsters’, show reader WHY #ufchat // Yes!
10:58 pm AuthorWilliam: Great chat today everyone. Must go feed the offspring. Thanks again to @UF_Chat for another good one. #ufchat
10:59 pm Jinxie_G: And I have no idea why that posted twice. lol #UFChat
10:59 pm Ben_Aaronovitch: Time for bed – byeeee #UFchat
10:59 pm UF_Chat: @LaylaMessner Do you prefer reading or writing hidden or both? #UFchat Examples?
11:00 pm CameronHaleyUF: @UF_Chat thanks for another great #UFchat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: Announcement: @Patti_OShea is our Special Guest Author for a Q&A on Paranormal Romance/ Urban Fantasy crossover, August 21st! #UFChat
11:00 pm VampBookClub: @leapetra Is it weird that I would TOTALLY read about the excluded werecow? Because I would. #UFchat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: Some new UF releases this last week by authors here on Twitter to be tweeted next, along with links to the books: #UFchat
11:00 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: Waking the Witch by @KelleyArmstrong http://alturl.com/m8jat #UFchat
11:01 pm LaylaMessner: @UF_Chat Both reading and writing hidden. Still trying to figure out why. Briggs. Meyer. Rowling. #UFChat
11:01 pm AudryT: @editorialdept Trick is to make a fantasy creature’s culture accessible to human understanding, but not grounded in human behavior. #ufchat
11:01 pm LaylaMessner: I am currently surrounded by chaos – difficult to think πŸ˜‰ #UFChat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: @VampBookClub @leapetra What? Werecow? Where? (Wanna read – adore cows – they’re very smart in their own way) #UFchat
11:01 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: Total Eclipse (Weather Warden #9 & Final in series) by @RachelCaine http://amzn.to/95Qxm6 #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: New UF release: Death?s Excellent Vacation (anthology) incl @Jeaniene_Frost @lilithsaintcrow @katiemacalister http://amzn.to/bkpZZi #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: Death Most Definite by @trentonomicon http://amzn.to/aiWP0F #UFchat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: The Demon Hunt by @MistressKrisG http://amzn.to/bMZKeT #UFchat
11:02 pm VampBookClub: For those #UFchat readers who also dig on the PNR, our August group read is @JASaare‘s CRIMSON MOON: http://ow.ly/2mtP9
11:02 pm LaylaMessner: @editorialdept I think the movement to have paranormals be like humans is balancing traditional tendency to treat as monsters #UFChat
11:02 pm UF_Chat: New UF releases this week: Vanished (PB) http://amzn.to/bCiryT & Labyrinth (HC) http://amzn.to/97Aybc both by @katrchrdsn #UFchat
11:02 pm jbeemills: My dogs just got out in the middle of chat. Almost got hit by a car. I guess monsters in the open can be scary… #ufchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: Kiss of the Rose: The Tudor Vampires by @Kate4Queen http://amzn.to/9vyKJN #UFchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: New UF release this week: Siren?s Call: Dark Tides by @DevynQuinn http://amzn.to/cXqYfo #UFchat
11:03 pm UF_Chat: We are slowly making a list of UF authors on Twitter on #UFchat blog site. Please suggest more by @-ing @UF_Chat, @inkgypsy or @snowppl
11:03 pm leapetra: @jbeemills Is he/she ok? #ufchat
11:04 pm editorialdept: @UF_Chat for future reference, here’s that post I mentioned – http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/01/hard-fantasy #ufchat
11:04 pm UF_Chat: That?s a wrap for #UFchat today! Please RT our special announcement: Q&A with @Patti_OShea on the UF/PR overlap ? August 21st!
11:05 pm jbeemills: They (one he & one she) are ok…after 15 minutes of hunting/chasing. Thx for asking. #ufchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: @jbeemills Oh goodness! Anything that threatens my animals or my kid gives me heart failure. Monsters come in all shapes/sizes. #UFchat
11:05 pm UF_Chat: RT @editorialdept: @UF_Chat for future reference, here’s that post I mentioned – http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/01/hard-fantasy #ufchat
11:06 pm LaylaMessner: @last_lines I have dif weres in my story too – must be a movement #UFChat
11:06 pm UF_Chat: @CameronHaleyUF Thank you! See you next week. πŸ™‚ #UFchat
11:07 pm UF_Chat: RT @AudryT: @editorialdept Trick is to make a fantasy creature’s culture accessible to human understanding, but not grounded in human behavior. #ufchat
11:08 pm leapetra: @last_lines I have werewolves, a berserk, and shapeshifters. Fun part, who’s clothes stay with them? #ufchat
11:08 pm UF_Chat: . @UF_Chat going dark. πŸ˜‰ Transcript will be available on #UFchat blog in 24hrs-ish allowing for post-chat comments to be added. πŸ™‚ Thx all!